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2010-12-15T00:33:46  <antimatroid> HeelToe: you choose your username and password on tcp, you assign the password the first time you use the username
2010-12-15T00:34:14  <HeelToe> ty
2010-12-15T00:34:36  <HeelToe> i don't think the server is running, but thanks anyway
2010-12-15T00:35:04  <antimatroid> there's probably no one to pair you wtih :P
2010-12-15T00:36:04  <HeelToe> yeah, figured
2010-12-15T00:36:39  <antimatroid> turn up during a contest and you will have plenty of competition
2010-12-15T00:37:02  <HeelToe> yeah, i made a bot, but it crashed on their system, while working fine on mine :/
2010-12-15T00:37:13  <antimatroid> c++?
2010-12-15T00:37:16  <HeelToe> pytho
2010-12-15T00:37:17  <antimatroid> i had that happen to me a few times
2010-12-15T00:37:17  <HeelToe> n
2010-12-15T00:37:22  <antimatroid> my final bot was all good though
2010-12-15T00:37:35  <HeelToe> did you find out why the other ones crashed?
2010-12-15T00:37:45  <antimatroid> nope
2010-12-15T00:37:55  <HeelToe> and yeah, I completely started over cause my submitted bot was crap
2010-12-15T00:38:14  <HeelToe> that sucks doesn't it, the mysterious failure of crashing every time...
2010-12-15T00:38:35  <antimatroid> i am extremely disappointed at how hard it is to create a process inside a program
2010-12-15T00:38:56  <Zannick> so easy!
2010-12-15T00:38:58  <Zannick> fork()
2010-12-15T00:39:03  <Zannick> >.>
2010-12-15T00:39:14  <Zannick> or with python, subprocess.Popen
2010-12-15T00:39:23  <HeelToe> like a thread?
2010-12-15T00:44:47  <antimatroid> Zannick: i don't know how to do it?
2010-12-15T00:44:47  <antimatroid> Can i create a variable like thing that is a process, where i can just input/output things from it like any other stream?
2010-12-15T00:44:50  <antimatroid> that would be coolest
2010-12-15T00:45:51  <Zannick> so, i'd have to look up exactly how that works, too
2010-12-15T00:46:00  <Zannick> but the subprocess module is what you want
2010-12-15T00:46:42  <Zannick> subprocess.Popen is a class that has stdin and stdout pipes that you can input/output to/from
2010-12-15T00:46:56  <Zannick> you can look at aicontest's own user_sadbox.py for an example
2010-12-15T00:47:33  <antimatroid> yeah okay, another option is to use boost
2010-12-15T00:47:42  <antimatroid> but then people need to have that installed, which i don't like
2010-12-15T00:48:10  <Zannick> for c/c++ it's way more complicated
2010-12-15T00:48:20  <Zannick> cause you can fork(), but that's a new process
2010-12-15T00:48:38  <antimatroid> http://www.netbsd.org/~jmmv/process/boost_process/usage.html#boost_process.usage.interprocess_communication
2010-12-15T00:48:51  <Zannick> sure
2010-12-15T00:48:57  * Zannick not familiar with boost
2010-12-15T00:49:01  <antimatroid> neither :P
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2010-12-15T03:20:14  <delt0r___> antimatroid: Java one thing they really got right --was a big arse standardize library for a lot of common things that's works across platforms
2010-12-15T03:20:57  <delt0r___> Seriously, I am disappointed that in 2010 we don't have that in some other "core" langs...
2010-12-15T03:21:19  <delt0r___> 20-30 years should have been enough time to sort that crap out
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2010-12-15T04:56:08  <aerique> "annhharison" is spamming the ai-contest forums
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2010-12-15T05:23:29  <antimatroid> delt0r___: amen :)
2010-12-15T06:07:59  <delt0r___> aerique: its fancy spam
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2010-12-15T07:19:05  <antimatroid1> lol, wtf annhharison
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2010-12-15T07:55:12  <antimatroid1> bah i give up
2010-12-15T07:55:25  <antimatroid1> i have nfi how to get processes to run and communicate
2010-12-15T07:55:37  <antimatroid1> i'll try with boost
2010-12-15T08:22:09  <Frontier> wow, 20 KB data for 200 turns with 2 ants in JSON
2010-12-15T08:28:26  <antimatroid1> :P
2010-12-15T08:28:52  <antimatroid1> i think i can get processes communicating with boost
2010-12-15T08:29:05  <antimatroid1> i'll try to get a backbone set up to use for any future cpp engine
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2010-12-15T09:05:43  <delt0r> antimatroid1, Why don't you use some of the C++ engines from the last comp. they have the whole process thing done for you
2010-12-15T09:06:16  <delt0r> also perhaps using python would be quicker... Its not a given we/they will go for ants as the final game
2010-12-15T09:06:25  <antimatroid1> delt0r: i've looked at albets, it's messier than i like, i'm working on a process struct now using boost that i can just use string streams to interact with
2010-12-15T09:06:55  <antimatroid1> i'm quite interested in getting this process struct written now anyway, i'm sure i'll find a use for it eventually
2010-12-15T09:07:33  <antimatroid1> (i'm a very stubborn and fussy person :) )
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2010-12-15T10:29:58  <antimatroid1> Frontier: you about?
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2010-12-15T10:32:38  <antimatroid1> i need to send you 3 rounds of moves each turn, and preferably have the visualiser iterate through that so you can sort of see what the game is doing
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2010-12-15T11:21:40  <antimatroid1> hmmm... unsure how to listen to two different things at once? and stop trying to read if a bot takes to long rather than checking the time of receiving each move
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2010-12-15T11:27:52  <delt0r_> antimatroid1: Non blocking IO
2010-12-15T11:28:16  <delt0r_> you have read methods that always return and output between 0 and more bytes
2010-12-15T11:28:38  <delt0r_> put them in a buffer check the other player... rinse and repeat
2010-12-15T11:29:40  <antimatroid1> delt0r: cheers
2010-12-15T11:29:42  <antimatroid1> it
2010-12-15T11:29:52  <antimatroid1> i'm going to head to bed then i'll fix it up tomorrow
2010-12-15T11:30:06  <antimatroid1> hopefully i can have a working engine by the end of tomorrow
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2010-12-15T12:50:39  <Frontier> 3 rounds of moves? what's going on?
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2010-12-15T19:15:36  <sigh> "it?s simplest to think of the state of your repository as a point in a high-dimensional ?code-space?,  in which branches are represented as n-dimensional membranes, mapping the spatial loci of successive commits onto the projected manifold of each cloned repository." - http://tartley.com/?p=1267
2010-12-15T19:15:40  <sigh> git made simple :P
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2010-12-15T19:23:51  <delt0r_> awesome...
2010-12-15T19:24:05  <delt0r_> now i finally understand branching in git
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2010-12-15T20:40:20  <Cyndre> so its going to be an ant game like planet wars?
2010-12-15T20:44:27  <antimatroid> Cyndre: it's just a possible option
2010-12-15T20:44:36  <antimatroid> and there are 2 considerably different versions of antwars
2010-12-15T20:45:21  <antimatroid> i've finally got processes communicating one way in c++
2010-12-15T20:45:27  <Cyndre> excellent article - http://www.jasonshen.com/2010/winning-isnt-normal/
2010-12-15T20:45:29  <antimatroid> it doesn't seem to like going bidirectionally atm
2010-12-15T20:45:59  <Cyndre> Im starting a redisgn of my bots brain :)
2010-12-15T20:46:59  <Cyndre> my irc bot that is - anyone care if he sits in here and learns from you?  it only talks on specific keywords
2010-12-15T20:47:28  <antimatroid> depends how common those words are :P
2010-12-15T20:47:35  <antimatroid> i don't think anyone would mind too much atm
2010-12-15T20:47:43  <antimatroid> possibly not leave it in here when a contest is on
2010-12-15T20:48:36  <Cyndre> scoreme - displays your sentence score, askim - ask the bot a question and returns a list of most likely answers, explainword word - breaks it down to noun etc
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2010-12-15T20:49:33  <antimatroid> scoreme - rainbow
2010-12-15T20:49:33  <CyndreBot_> antimatroid, your current score is .
2010-12-15T20:49:37  <Zannick> my irc bots tend to use '<botname>: ' as the trigger
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2010-12-15T20:49:37  <antimatroid> it's broken :P
2010-12-15T20:49:40  <Cyndre> lmao
2010-12-15T20:49:44  <antimatroid> that should be inf
2010-12-15T20:49:51  <Cyndre> hes never heard you speak
2010-12-15T20:50:06  <Cyndre> hmm, maybe time for error handling
2010-12-15T20:50:11  <antimatroid> rainbow rainbow rainbow rainbow
2010-12-15T20:50:14  <antimatroid> scoreme
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2010-12-15T20:50:24  <Zannick> that tends to keep the inadvertent triggering to a minimum
2010-12-15T20:50:26  <antimatroid> lol, should pay attention more :)
2010-12-15T20:50:38  <Cyndre> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:50:38  <CyndreBot_> Cyndre, your current score is 106.
2010-12-15T20:50:58  <antimatroid> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:50:58  <CyndreBot_> antimatroid, your current score is 116.
2010-12-15T20:51:01  <antimatroid> yeah :P
2010-12-15T20:51:14  <antimatroid> is that number of chars read?
2010-12-15T20:51:17  <antimatroid> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:51:17  <CyndreBot_> antimatroid, your current score is 101.
2010-12-15T20:51:21  <antimatroid> no :s
2010-12-15T20:51:53  <Zannick> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:51:53  <CyndreBot_> Zannick, your current score is 160.
2010-12-15T20:52:00  <Zannick> B)
2010-12-15T20:52:01  <Cyndre> its based on your sentence structure and what the bot already knows.  Every word pair is evaluated, assigned a score, and used to score you.  If your score is less then the word pair, your score goes up, word pair score goes down and vice versa
2010-12-15T20:52:31  <Zannick> interesting
2010-12-15T20:52:45  <Cyndre> want to change it to word triplets though
2010-12-15T20:53:07  <Zannick> and this is to seed a markov generator?
2010-12-15T20:53:12  <Zannick> yeah, that's pretty interesting
2010-12-15T20:53:19  <Cyndre> no, to decide how to rank memorys
2010-12-15T20:53:59  <Zannick> well, it seems like an interesting idea for a markov generator
2010-12-15T20:54:05  <Cyndre> ie - the higher the score, the higher the respect for the person and more likely to find things they say important
2010-12-15T20:54:15  <Cyndre> askbot who is the president of the united states of america
2010-12-15T20:54:32  <CyndreBot_> obama, people, has, were, many, help, their, any, bush, over, black, doesn, does, person, also, us, because, change, world, thats, time, still, make, american, than, based, war, our, years, being, wes
2010-12-15T20:54:50  <Zannick> i know a guy named wes :)
2010-12-15T20:55:09  <Cyndre> so the score is how it learns from you.  It stops dumb people from teaching it and in fact he will down mod things they say
2010-12-15T20:55:43  <Cyndre> and then it will also use the word pair scores durring sentence generation
2010-12-15T20:56:23  <sigh> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:56:23  <CyndreBot_> sigh, your current score is 34.
2010-12-15T20:56:33  <sigh> it doesn't like me :(
2010-12-15T20:56:49  <Zannick> askbot what is the next game for the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:56:57  <CyndreBot_> play, action, into, im, make, where, should, year, use, their, d, his, over, because, going, even, am, go, which, own, dont, who, been, point, playing, 0, re, when, day, king, any, than, top, don, cha
2010-12-15T20:57:34  <Cyndre> scoreme
2010-12-15T20:57:34  <CyndreBot_> Cyndre, your current score is 179.
2010-12-15T20:57:36  <Zannick> the next game will be "play" or "play action"
2010-12-15T20:57:37  <Zannick> haha
2010-12-15T20:57:54  <Cyndre> I suggest atari tank wars for the next game in the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:58:03  <Cyndre> askbot what is the next game for the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:58:04  <CyndreBot_> play, action, into, im, make, where, should, year, use, suggest, their, d, wars, his, over, because, going, even, am, atari, go, tank, which, own, dont, who, been, point, playing, re, 0, when, day, ki
2010-12-15T20:58:18  <Cyndre> I suggest atari tank wars for the next game in the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:58:20  <Cyndre> askbot what is the next game for the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:58:20  <CyndreBot_> play, action, into, suggest, im, wars, make, where, tank, atari, should, year, use, their, d, his, over, because, going, even, am, go, which, own, dont, who, been, point, playing, 0, re, when, day, ki
2010-12-15T20:58:29  <Cyndre> almost the number 1 answer
2010-12-15T20:58:57  <sigh> you are cheating
2010-12-15T20:59:01  <Zannick> i suggest tron for the last game in the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:59:03  <sigh> Accoun won't like that
2010-12-15T20:59:03  <Cyndre> nope, just teaching it
2010-12-15T20:59:07  <Zannick> askbot what is the next game for the ai contest
2010-12-15T20:59:07  <CyndreBot_> play, action, suggest, into, im, wars, make, where, atari, tank, should, year, use, their, d, his, over, because, going, even, am, go, which, own, dont, last, who, been, point, playing, re, 0, when, d
2010-12-15T20:59:31  <Zannick> well, now 'suggest' is getting up there :P
2010-12-15T21:00:41  <sigh> how come 'd' makes the list twice?
2010-12-15T21:00:51  <antimatroid> hmmm... i have processes opening now, but i can't get my opened process to take input from the program rather than my terminal window :\
2010-12-15T21:00:58  <antimatroid> any of you played around with popen before
2010-12-15T21:01:07  <Cyndre> yea, I dont have the word type working yet - my goal is to determine what the question is missnig in order to find what type of word the answer should be
2010-12-15T21:01:21  <Cyndre> it truncates at a certain length
2010-12-15T21:02:10  <Cyndre> explainword suggest
2010-12-15T21:02:10  <CyndreBot_> suggest =  verb: 3  noun: 1  adjective: 0  adverb: 0  pronoun: 0  preposition: 0  person: 9  place: 6  thing: 17  idea: 3
2010-12-15T21:02:35  <Cyndre> didnt do a good job on that one - but it only has like 3 or 4 words to classify on
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2010-12-15T23:05:41  <Cyndre> anyone alive?
2010-12-15T23:06:24  <Zannick> everyone is dead
2010-12-15T23:06:45  <Cyndre> I see that
2010-12-15T23:06:50  <Cyndre> and dead people
2010-12-15T23:06:57  <Zannick> askbot how is everyone
2010-12-15T23:07:00  <CyndreBot_> up, here, than, way, subjective, minus, got, doing, people, their, other, hey, through, best, who, am, anyone, hi, where, good, when, else, interpretations, down, mutation, vandalism, same, yes, had,
2010-12-15T23:07:09  <Cyndre> subjective :)
2010-12-15T23:07:26  <Zannick> aw, i was hoping to see 'dead' make the list
2010-12-15T23:07:31  <Cyndre> askbot list the alphabet
2010-12-15T23:07:33  <CyndreBot_> p, o, x, y, u, n, m, l, h, g, f, e, d, c, divided, dont, http, bydivided, minus, up, wikipedia, when, him, which, trying, his, reason, re, ordered, am, pixels, q, r, v, z, w, k, j, into, b, letters, w
2010-12-15T23:07:52  <Zannick> wikipedia is part of the alphabet, yep.
2010-12-15T23:08:04  <Cyndre> askbot 2 + 2 = x
2010-12-15T23:08:19  <CyndreBot_> 0, 1, 2, times, minus, 1divided, divided, v, by2, 3, e, y, m, p, 4, l, 5, c, u, sin, 6, h, d, f, bys, 7, right, use, b, r, now, q, mdivided, 8, sqrt, cos, than, bysqrt, bydt, 2divided, where, 9, got,
2010-12-15T23:08:26  <Cyndre> hes a stupid bot
2010-12-15T23:08:44  <Cyndre> one thing I have found is at first it worked awsome, but after time it started getting flooded with crap
2010-12-15T23:09:12  <Cyndre> I think I need to implement a pruning where all scores are lowered or something
2010-12-15T23:09:39  <Cyndre> 777 + 222 = 999
2010-12-15T23:09:47  <Cyndre> askbot x + 222 = 999
2010-12-15T23:09:48  <CyndreBot_> times, 0, c, use, where, right, ok, more, around, left, try, 1, divided, cases, v, 2, anything, 3, sin, p, 1divided, minus, y, back, were, h, really, 4, b, top, once, 5, m, by2, l, e, cos, sqrt, 6, 7,
2010-12-15T23:10:13  <Cyndre> it looks like the garbage has collected around the + and =
2010-12-15T23:10:44  <Cyndre> hmmm, I should demod based on the number of connections to other words it has and the relative scores
2010-12-15T23:14:23  <antimatroid> i'm wrestling with c++
2010-12-15T23:14:36  <antimatroid> i almost had processes working with popen, i can't feed the process information :(
2010-12-15T23:15:01  <Cyndre> if total_wordpair_score/total_wordpairs > wordpair_score    wordpair_score -= total_wordpair_score/total_wordpairs   or something
2010-12-15T23:15:01  <antimatroid> fputs doesn't seem to work, it demands i input it from actual std::in
2010-12-15T23:21:58  <Cyndre> http://book.chinaunix.net/special/ebook/addisonWesley/APUE2/0201433079/ch15lev1sec3.html   not sure if it helps, it just gives the std::in method
2010-12-15T23:22:48  <Cyndre> are you flushing the buffer with your fputs?
2010-12-15T23:24:02  <antimatroid> i am
2010-12-15T23:24:07  <antimatroid> still doesn't seem to do anything
2010-12-15T23:24:16  <Cyndre> http://www.daniweb.com/forums/thread329170.html    is this helpful?
2010-12-15T23:25:33  <antimatroid> not really, forking creates a child process of the same file
2010-12-15T23:25:44  <antimatroid> i need processes of different files with input/output streams between them
2010-12-15T23:26:12  <antimatroid> i'm trying to get it all into a process struct with no extra libraries so i never have to think about it again
2010-12-15T23:28:21  <SmkMnstr> whats question?
2010-12-15T23:29:21  <SmkMnstr> if you want to both read/write from process you start's stdin/stdout you cant use popen i guess
2010-12-15T23:29:51  <SmkMnstr> popen only for unidirectional, dumping output to prog, or reading input from prog
2010-12-15T23:30:36  <SmkMnstr> for bidiretional you have to do it manually with seris of pipe(), dup2() and fork() / execve()
2010-12-15T23:31:44  <antimatroid> people keep saying use fork?
2010-12-15T23:31:52  <antimatroid> how do i fork a process that isn't the same file?
2010-12-15T23:32:02  <antimatroid> i thought it just forked a child process that is the same
2010-12-15T23:32:07  <Zannick> it does
2010-12-15T23:32:07  <SmkMnstr> you fork THEN exec
2010-12-15T23:32:13  <Zannick> namely "fork returns twice"
2010-12-15T23:32:17  <SmkMnstr> thats what popen() does
2010-12-15T23:32:27  <Zannick> but "exec never returns"
2010-12-15T23:32:44  <SmkMnstr> well put Zannick
2010-12-15T23:32:57  <antimatroid> hmmm, i don't get it, is there a page that explains the two things?
2010-12-15T23:33:06  <antimatroid> i swear google is failing me miserably
2010-12-15T23:33:06  <Zannick> generally you see pid = fork(); if (pid == 0) { /* child */ exec( ... ); }
2010-12-15T23:33:38  <Zannick> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fork-exec
2010-12-15T23:33:43  <SmkMnstr> its the bidirectional IO control of a program what youre trying to achieve?
2010-12-15T23:34:06  <Zannick> most of my knowledge of this comes from the systems classes i took at college
2010-12-15T23:34:20  * antimatroid didn't take any such classes 
2010-12-15T23:34:28  <Zannick> they were required for me
2010-12-15T23:34:33  <Zannick> maybe you just haven't yet
2010-12-15T23:34:38  <antimatroid> my uni comp department is worse than bad :P
2010-12-15T23:34:47  <antimatroid> i graduated yesterday :P
2010-12-15T23:34:54  <SmkMnstr> i was a bigtime unix programmer in 90s :)
2010-12-15T23:34:55  <Zannick> or you didn't go to a good school like cmu ;)
2010-12-15T23:35:01  <antimatroid> i also did the bare minimum to finish a cs major
2010-12-15T23:35:09  <Zannick> i see
2010-12-15T23:36:26  <antimatroid> (i did economics and maths majors which filled the rest of my time)
2010-12-15T23:36:38  <Zannick> triple major?
2010-12-15T23:36:43  <Zannick> i doubled in math and that was tought
2010-12-15T23:36:45  <antimatroid> anyway, i'ma go get some subway then try to do it with fork/exec etc. and if that fails possibly give up
2010-12-15T23:36:46  <Zannick> tough *
2010-12-15T23:36:59  <antimatroid> yep, lots of 5 unit semesters
2010-12-15T23:36:59  <Zannick> but i still took the hardest cs class (Operating Systems) and got a B
2010-12-15T23:37:14  <antimatroid> my hardest 2 classes were analysis 3 and algebra 4
2010-12-15T23:37:18  <antimatroid> algebra 3**
2010-12-15T23:37:30  <Zannick> that's very vague
2010-12-15T23:38:02  <antimatroid> analysis was intros to metric, normed and hilbert spaces, algebra 3 was more on group and ring theory from second year
2010-12-15T23:38:17  <Zannick> ah, those are similar to one of my classes
2010-12-15T23:38:20  <antimatroid> i already did a real and complex analysis unit before that, for some reason my uni does it the other way to most others
2010-12-15T23:38:40  <Zannick> termed "math studies" and was about 5 courses crammed into the time equivalent of two
2010-12-15T23:38:51  <antimatroid> but i get to do lots of analysis and algebra next year, i'm not doing a single applied unit :)
2010-12-15T23:38:54  <Zannick> over a full year
2010-12-15T23:39:02  <antimatroid> sounds nice
2010-12-15T23:39:04  <Zannick> have fun with that :)
2010-12-15T23:39:23  <Zannick> i'm done with school, now i have a full-time job
2010-12-15T23:39:39  <antimatroid> i'm torn about doing a phd or going off to work
2010-12-15T23:39:48  <antimatroid> but i'm at least doing honours in maths next year and maybe masters after that
2010-12-15T23:40:01  <antimatroid> phd would probably be in economics or cs with game theory
2010-12-15T23:40:17  <SmkMnstr> heh i can help w the pipe thing
2010-12-15T23:40:18  <Zannick> pretty cool
2010-12-15T23:40:23  <SmkMnstr> its funny because it could take u a really long time
2010-12-15T23:40:32  <SmkMnstr> but i can probably make it in like 15 min
2010-12-15T23:40:35  <SmkMnstr> its one of those rare times
2010-12-15T23:40:42  <SmkMnstr> having a memorized contra code pays off
2010-12-15T23:41:33  <antimatroid> SmkMnstr: how long are you going to be around?
2010-12-15T23:41:48  <SmkMnstr> awhile
2010-12-15T23:41:52  <antimatroid> i might try and get your help in a bit, i just need to go get some subway
2010-12-15T23:41:59  <antimatroid> i'm staving and it's 3 40pm :P
2010-12-15T23:41:59  <SmkMnstr> cool ill probably be here when u get back
2010-12-15T23:42:22  <SmkMnstr> actually i remmeber there is even more stuff u have to do to use stdio
2010-12-15T23:43:28  <SmkMnstr> easier to just read() and write() to fds than to use fgets fputs fwrite
2010-12-15T23:43:55  <antimatroid> yeah, i'm realising that
2010-12-15T23:44:09  <antimatroid> i'll clean up what i'm trying to do when i get back then get your help
2010-12-15T23:44:13  <antimatroid> it's a bit of a mess atm
2010-12-15T23:44:41  <SmkMnstr> cool
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