2011-01-18T00:10:15 *** amstan has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-01-18T00:31:04 *** chris__0076 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T00:31:05 *** Chris_0076 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-01-18T00:31:24 ooo http://aliciapatterson.org/APF0704/Johnson/Johnson.html 2011-01-18T00:59:18 *** tapwater has quit IRC (Quit: tapwater) 2011-01-18T01:04:31 *** Frontier has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T01:07:00 *** chris___0076 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T01:09:08 *** chris__0076 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T01:11:05 *** chris__0076 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T01:13:56 *** chris___0076 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T01:42:29 *** sigh has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T01:47:03 *** AlliedEnvy has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2011-01-18T01:49:19 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T01:53:47 *** AlliedEnvy has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T02:11:24 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T02:12:44 *** delt0r___ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T02:22:20 *** Mathnerd314 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T02:41:44 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T02:42:50 amstan_irssi: Stratego too complicated? seriously? 2011-01-18T03:02:11 *** mega1 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T03:29:41 *** perror has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T03:42:42 *** aerique has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T03:47:52 *** Kingpin13 has quit IRC (Quit: You're a kitty!) 2011-01-18T04:08:53 *** boegel has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T04:32:11 *** Naktibalda has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T05:15:36 *** rabidus has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2011-01-18T05:17:33 *** rabidus has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T05:24:08 *** Palmik has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T05:28:46 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T05:50:51 delt0r_: or ants too awesome? wtf 2011-01-18T05:51:42 I am sorry... i really don't like the ants... 2011-01-18T05:51:49 the more i think about it 2011-01-18T05:51:55 the more i don't like it 2011-01-18T05:52:09 its just too..... boids or "alife" 2011-01-18T05:56:06 *** sigh has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-01-18T05:57:52 that was my point, i'm rather against what they have atm 2011-01-18T05:58:00 for ants that is 2011-01-18T05:58:35 well i think stratego is an easy "random" bot and a easy engine... 2011-01-18T05:58:52 but even a half reasonable bot would be hard. 2011-01-18T05:59:14 my vote is for stratego out of what currently seems offered 2011-01-18T05:59:21 me too 2011-01-18T05:59:24 amstan seems to think it's too hard 2011-01-18T05:59:46 lets see why when he is back online... 2011-01-18T05:59:47 *** Blkt has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T06:00:11 that comment before wasn't the first time, i asked yesterday about it and he said the same 2011-01-18T06:00:11 oh i just got a vps for a tcp game host too 2011-01-18T06:00:22 nice 2011-01-18T06:00:39 cheap... so it may sux with connectivity... 2011-01-18T06:00:46 we will see 2011-01-18T06:00:56 100EU for a whole year is really cheap 2011-01-18T06:01:22 but then 15 hours later they havent activated it yet... 2011-01-18T06:01:22 i live off $250/au a fortnight most of the time 2011-01-18T06:01:28 so not a good sign 2011-01-18T06:01:32 but i still live at home, so it's not that hard 2011-01-18T06:01:36 oh to be a student 2011-01-18T06:01:43 I remeber it well 2011-01-18T06:02:13 I use to *make* my wife and daughter come to *anything* with free food... and eat up *fast* 2011-01-18T06:02:45 haha, you aren't a true uni student unless you love free food 2011-01-18T06:03:01 well now i get some decent money... 2011-01-18T06:03:13 I still turn up to anything with free beer and food 2011-01-18T06:03:20 or just one or the other 2011-01-18T06:03:35 you never really shake it off 2011-01-18T06:04:00 good day everyone 2011-01-18T06:04:20 good day 2011-01-18T06:04:23 i think 2011-01-18T06:04:41 but i am at work... the snow is melting and its a lovely day outside.... 2011-01-18T06:04:44 thats not good 2011-01-18T06:04:56 i should be skiing 2011-01-18T06:07:41 i wish we got enough snow to do that 2011-01-18T06:07:56 we get snow on top of a nearby mountain in the winter for a bit, but not enough for that 2011-01-18T06:08:09 even NZ has snow 2011-01-18T06:08:17 and less floods 2011-01-18T06:08:20 or bush fires 2011-01-18T06:08:26 but we have more possums 2011-01-18T06:08:36 less kangaroos thankfully 2011-01-18T06:27:28 we don't really have kangaroos in tassie i don't think 2011-01-18T06:27:33 some wallabies, but nowhere near where i live 2011-01-18T06:27:54 they jump along the roads near where my mum lives in canberra 2011-01-18T06:28:03 unfortunately not with me on their back 2011-01-18T07:19:57 *** delt0r___ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T07:21:11 *** delt0r_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T08:27:13 *** dr- has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T08:52:17 *** asdf_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:13:04 *** amstan_irssi has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2011-01-18T09:13:04 *** jbroman has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2011-01-18T09:13:48 *** iFire has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:16:12 *** iFire` has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2011-01-18T09:19:01 *** CIA-1 is now known as 45PABO3DN 2011-01-18T09:19:02 *** jbroman has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:19:08 *** 45PABO3DN is now known as CIA-48 2011-01-18T09:19:13 *** alex___ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:19:22 *** alex___ is now known as amstan_i 2011-01-18T09:19:49 delt0r___, jmcarthur, antimatroid1: jeff feels like stratego is too hard, with the many kinds of units and so on 2011-01-18T09:20:21 also.. stratego is like ants: it's better when there's more than 2 players 2011-01-18T09:21:42 rankings will be less stable i imagine 2011-01-18T09:21:57 and i'm yet to come across anyone who finds that ants game overly interesting 2011-01-18T09:22:22 amstan_i: what was the new idea you mentioned? 2011-01-18T09:22:28 well, did but didn't 2011-01-18T09:23:33 amstan_i: right... and you? what do you think (just getting a feel for future suggestions) 2011-01-18T09:24:00 delt0r___: weren't you working on a game idea as well? 2011-01-18T09:24:05 amstan_i: and what about some kind of RPS stratego? 2011-01-18T09:24:06 yes 2011-01-18T09:24:14 a RTS type game.. 2011-01-18T09:24:24 I my have it out this weekend 2011-01-18T09:24:31 but work keeps getting in the way 2011-01-18T09:24:35 if stratego is too hard, delt0rs game is out 2011-01-18T09:24:48 it was only 1-4 unit types 2011-01-18T09:25:01 *** weechat_user has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:25:06 but the game mechanics is much harder yeah? 2011-01-18T09:25:18 well --in that they are "dynamic" yes 2011-01-18T09:25:33 in terms of "rules" not really 2011-01-18T09:25:36 i'm keen, but it sounds more complicated than stratego 2011-01-18T09:25:40 *** chris___0076 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:25:45 you shoot an enemy... he gets damaged 2011-01-18T09:26:26 well i must admit i don't really see whats complicated about stratego... even with "many unit types" they are really simple rules... 2011-01-18T09:26:27 *** Naktibalda_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:26:36 Rank 10 beats everything below it 2011-01-18T09:26:37 etc 2011-01-18T09:26:52 rank 9 beats.. every thing below that... 2011-01-18T09:27:12 i like having 1 v 10 gives player 1 the win 2011-01-18T09:27:17 *** perror_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:27:27 whatever 2011-01-18T09:27:28 but i am interested in something less discrete 2011-01-18T09:27:37 its isomorphic ;) 2011-01-18T09:27:50 its equivalent... 2011-01-18T09:27:52 what? 2011-01-18T09:27:56 discrete to continuous? 2011-01-18T09:28:00 thats stronger than isomorphic... 2011-01-18T09:28:03 no 2011-01-18T09:28:04 i know what an isomorphism is :P 2011-01-18T09:28:05 1 or 10 2011-01-18T09:28:17 *** dr- has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T09:28:17 *** chris__0076 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T09:28:18 *** Naktibalda has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T09:28:18 *** perror has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T09:28:28 ie 1,2,3 or 10,9,8 2011-01-18T09:28:42 no, larger numbers would still win, except 1 would not only beat 10, but win the game 2011-01-18T09:28:54 ?? 2011-01-18T09:29:01 so you want to protect your 1 until you think you know their 10 2011-01-18T09:29:01 what are you talking about? 2011-01-18T09:29:06 *** weechat_user has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2011-01-18T09:29:07 then you go after their 10 with your 1 to win 2011-01-18T09:29:12 na 2011-01-18T09:29:18 sounds dumb 2011-01-18T09:29:27 thats a spy btw 2011-01-18T09:29:32 yeah 2011-01-18T09:29:35 but it won't win you the game 2011-01-18T09:29:41 but its close 2011-01-18T09:29:42 that's a primary school game i played 2011-01-18T09:30:13 *** dr`tmp has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:30:37 *** Naktibalda_ is now known as Naktibalda 2011-01-18T09:31:13 what about doing primary school level flags? separate the grid in half, let players place their flag and have a fog of war (they all sort of have to know the entire map for walls), then you can capture them if they're on your half sending htem to jail and they have to get your flag onto their half of the grid? is that stratego? I think i need to read that better 2011-01-18T09:31:37 ?? 2011-01-18T09:32:20 * delt0r___ has no idea what antimatroid1 is talking about 2011-01-18T09:33:49 game idea: take a 2n x 2n grid with randomly placed walls, split it in half and let each player place their x agents and flag on their half, then have the players try to capture the other players flag and take it back to their half of the grid, if you get "caught" by them on their side of the grid, you are "captured/killed/whatever" 2011-01-18T09:34:11 oh 2011-01-18T09:34:13 right... 2011-01-18T09:34:19 well with grid movement... 2011-01-18T09:34:25 it sounds boring... sorry 2011-01-18T09:34:45 no need to be sorry :P 2011-01-18T09:34:52 i'm just throwing out primary school games i played 2011-01-18T09:35:26 although we played them on an actual oval with real people :p 2011-01-18T09:35:30 with A* i think you could get close or at least close to optimal stats 2011-01-18T09:35:33 strats 2011-01-18T09:35:34 or sometimes the entire playground 2011-01-18T09:35:52 i play a vairant with paint ball 2011-01-18T09:36:13 what about dots and boxes? 2011-01-18T09:37:12 only the flag is a bit bright yellow drum thats full of nuts 2011-01-18T09:40:57 I just watched a video of someone playing Stratego. I like how you can set up traps around your flag :D, but who is going to create all the gfx for our game of ... what was it? Flags and sheep? 2011-01-18T09:40:58 I wouldn't be interested 2011-01-18T09:40:58 games like that i would just stick with chess or go 2011-01-18T09:40:58 planet wars was different 2011-01-18T09:40:58 yeah, i don't want to go away from simultaneous anyway 2011-01-18T09:40:58 planet wars was a great game 2011-01-18T09:40:58 as was tron 2011-01-18T09:40:58 as is stratego.. 2011-01-18T09:40:58 i like the hiden information part 2011-01-18T09:40:58 in fact i like hidden information for games in general 2011-01-18T09:40:58 amstan_i: convince j3camero to do stratego 2011-01-18T09:40:58 well i have a vps comming online soon 2011-01-18T09:40:58 I could do my own one... 2011-01-18T09:40:58 could get aobut ---what 3 players 2011-01-18T09:40:58 .. you may just end up "wasting" (minus fun) your time 2011-01-18T09:40:58 at least i would get 3rd 2011-01-18T09:40:59 me 2011-01-18T09:40:59 I would do it 2011-01-18T09:40:59 mite even learn js for a web version... 2011-01-18T09:40:59 but first cut would be java 2011-01-18T09:41:03 * antimatroid1 puts his vote in for delt0r making visualiser 2011-01-18T09:41:07 jbotmanager <3 2011-01-18T09:41:23 a lot of people used it in the end 2011-01-18T09:41:26 and it was pretty rough 2011-01-18T09:41:37 yes, but it was the best alternative 2011-01-18T09:41:50 just for functions 2011-01-18T09:41:57 tcp and human mode specifically 2011-01-18T09:43:44 *** delt0r___ has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-01-18T09:43:58 *** delt0r___ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T09:44:06 what did i miss 2011-01-18T09:44:11 * delt0r___ looks at the logs 2011-01-18T09:44:18 antimatroid1, delt0r___ : he doesn't like the fact that there's multiple types of units 2011-01-18T09:44:44 but there is not really... just one type with a "rank" property 2011-01-18T09:44:53 honestly 2011-01-18T09:45:09 how do you even visualize that? 2011-01-18T09:45:10 one type of unit limits the kind of games from chess down to checkers 2011-01-18T09:45:17 and tic tac toe 2011-01-18T09:45:31 Visualise it with a number 2011-01-18T09:45:38 right now.. our visualizer... is one square per pixel 2011-01-18T09:45:46 and it seems kinda neat like that 2011-01-18T09:45:46 ?? 2011-01-18T09:45:49 you don't need such large maps 2011-01-18T09:45:56 ok, fine 2011-01-18T09:46:09 numbers are boring though.. 2011-01-18T09:46:17 standart stratego is 10x10 2011-01-18T09:46:23 no, a lack of interesting strategy is boring 2011-01-18T09:46:32 well its a response to the "too many kinds of units" 2011-01-18T09:46:34 ok, show me a game example 2011-01-18T09:46:47 we made one for ants 2011-01-18T09:46:49 because the unit interaction is very simple 2011-01-18T09:46:53 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_-dabt0ee8 2011-01-18T09:47:07 you can also play online 2011-01-18T09:48:01 the intended version is all simultaneous yeah? 2011-01-18T09:48:26 well you can all the largest number a "feild marshall" 2011-01-18T09:48:28 yeah 2011-01-18T09:48:45 or a "black dragon" 2011-01-18T09:48:53 but i don't see how you can make such a game if it's pretty much turn based 2011-01-18T09:48:57 but then there are "too many unit types" 2011-01-18T09:49:14 look at planet wars... there are turns, but they're pretty fluid 2011-01-18T09:49:29 jmcarthur worked out the simulationus turns variant 2011-01-18T09:50:01 seriosly... unit types don't lead to complexity... its rules that do 2011-01-18T09:50:18 unit types are rules 2011-01-18T09:50:39 not if the rules for all unit "types" are the same 2011-01-18T09:50:39 that stratego video actually looks kind of boring to watch 2011-01-18T09:50:48 antimatroid1: +1 2011-01-18T09:51:16 and ants? or Go? or chess? 2011-01-18T09:51:18 delt0r___: what's the point of having unit types if they're all the same 2011-01-18T09:51:19 or tron? 2011-01-18T09:51:33 go and chess are killed 2011-01-18T09:51:43 So only the spy can capture the marshal, and only the minor can defuse the bomb, and the bomb and flag cannot move. That's all, right? Everything else is rank vs rank. 2011-01-18T09:52:01 amstan_i: FFS --if you want to take is seriously read the rules... otherwise don't... and don't claim its someone else that doesn't want to play 2011-01-18T09:52:11 thats fine 2011-01-18T09:52:20 you don't have to wnat to play it 2011-01-18T09:52:27 or have it for the next round 2011-01-18T09:52:44 delt0r___: i'm just saying.. jeff didn't like it when he looked at it 2011-01-18T09:52:49 don't kill the messenger 2011-01-18T09:53:03 did he look at it as close as you have? 2011-01-18T09:53:09 i'm still rather unconvinced, i don't hate it, but i would like to see something more exciting 2011-01-18T09:53:19 well sugest away 2011-01-18T09:53:23 suggest 2011-01-18T09:53:23 we moved from idea to idea yesterday 2011-01-18T09:53:31 considered like 5 games 2011-01-18T09:53:38 here in IRC? 2011-01-18T09:53:40 besides the ones already suggested 2011-01-18T09:53:43 no.. IRL 2011-01-18T09:53:56 hard to read those logs 2011-01-18T09:54:06 he's working on a sim for hot vs cold now 2011-01-18T09:54:12 ?? 2011-01-18T09:54:13 we'll see how that works 2011-01-18T09:54:14 what is that? 2011-01-18T09:54:27 so.. each player has 1 agent on a grid 2011-01-18T09:54:29 isn't it stratego in the end ? ^^ 2011-01-18T09:54:35 it emits either coldness or hotness 2011-01-18T09:54:47 and every turn you can move, and every turn the hot and cold spreads 2011-01-18T09:54:55 with some kind of conservation of energy blur 2011-01-18T09:55:22 that has a bit of promise, why only one agent per player? 2011-01-18T09:55:22 imagine the visualizer for that 2011-01-18T09:55:33 antimatroid1: why do you need more? 2011-01-18T09:55:41 harder 2011-01-18T09:56:03 too easy to do a basic tree with 1 agent imo 2011-01-18T09:56:32 amstan_i: tbh is sounds boring... not everyone finds physics really fun to watch 2011-01-18T09:56:40 not on a 1024x1024 grid 2011-01-18T09:57:15 also i think you could come up with optimal strategies for that too 2011-01-18T09:57:30 i'd prefer an interesting and complicated game on smaller maps 2011-01-18T09:57:31 diffusion process is well understood 2011-01-18T09:57:35 rather than a basic game on a huge map 2011-01-18T09:58:23 i also agree with delt0r in that something with private information would be cool 2011-01-18T09:58:38 private info? 2011-01-18T09:58:42 Well, in my opinion that isn't more interesting to watch than a match of Stratego. The military ranks could be replaced with something the kids love today... vampires and werewolves anyone? 2011-01-18T09:58:46 information you know that they don't 2011-01-18T09:59:06 Frontier: we're not kids though 2011-01-18T09:59:10 Frontier: vampires and warewolves? shoot me now :P 2011-01-18T09:59:21 Frontier: and that ^^^ would be the reaction of many 2011-01-18T09:59:22 lol, what were the other ideas amstan? 2011-01-18T09:59:24 amstan_i: don't tell me what i'm not :P 2011-01-18T09:59:26 Frontier: you forgot bella 2011-01-18T09:59:37 Frontier: I was going to use dragons 2011-01-18T09:59:43 dragons++ 2011-01-18T09:59:49 you can't go wrong with unicorns 2011-01-18T09:59:50 or zombies... but zombies was more of a joke 2011-01-18T10:00:26 and you defent the fluffy pink unicorn 2011-01-18T10:00:45 unicorns aren't pink or fluffy 2011-01-18T10:00:50 what universe are you living in? 2011-01-18T10:00:54 its so fluffy i think i;m gunna die, flufy 2011-01-18T10:00:57 Unicorns heh? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5im0Ssyyus 2011-01-18T10:01:13 antimatroid1: ones with *real* unicorns 2011-01-18T10:02:19 what about that turn based / continous 2d fighter plane game? 2011-01-18T10:02:19 amstan_i: what are the chances of a RTS type game passing the "too many types of things" test? 2011-01-18T10:02:32 antimatroid1: my rts is bascially that 2011-01-18T10:02:39 if you only have fighers 2011-01-18T10:02:40 let's do that 2011-01-18T10:02:42 fighters 2011-01-18T10:03:08 people can Euler up (got that yesterday) and learn a tiny bit of maths 2011-01-18T10:03:12 it wont hurt them 2011-01-18T10:03:23 well you don't really need to 2011-01-18T10:03:26 sounds like oil her up though 2011-01-18T10:03:55 you can get away with pretty crude estimates for things and can leave the physics out 2011-01-18T10:04:11 yeah, but if you want a good bot surely you want to do some maths? 2011-01-18T10:04:25 may bee 2011-01-18T10:04:43 if i knew what would work... i wouldn't suggest it 2011-01-18T10:04:48 anyway, i'm going to bed 2011-01-18T10:04:49 it's 2am 2011-01-18T10:06:46 amstan_i: what other types of games did you discuss? 2011-01-18T10:07:59 delt0r___: a kind of dots and boxes 2011-01-18T10:08:06 delt0r___: some stuff with mazes, that would be cool 2011-01-18T10:08:46 mmm 2011-01-18T10:09:29 *** asdf_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2011-01-18T10:10:52 anything even remotely similar to planet wars? 2011-01-18T10:13:08 no 2011-01-18T10:14:48 *** atriplez has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T10:25:59 *** mceier has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T10:53:11 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan_i 2011-01-18T10:56:49 *** perror_ has quit IRC (Quit: Bye all !) 2011-01-18T10:57:09 *** perror has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T11:14:46 *** Blkt` has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T11:17:23 *** Blkt has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T11:21:23 *** aerique has quit IRC (Quit: ...) 2011-01-18T11:24:06 *** Migi32 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T11:25:19 i don't understand this notion of rules that seems so complicated... 2011-01-18T11:25:36 rules are things like "you can't move flags or bombs" or "you can only move a unit one square at a time" 2011-01-18T11:26:05 *rules that can make things more complicated 2011-01-18T11:26:19 things like "A beats B and B beats C" are not rules that make things more complicated 2011-01-18T11:32:54 *** Blkt` has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-01-18T11:36:54 *** boegel has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T11:38:11 certainly not for starting out, at least. of course it complicates your strategies, but that's the point 2011-01-18T11:45:32 dude, planet wars should have looked like this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ZpkFJ1GB4 2011-01-18T11:55:14 jmcarthur: sorry not really following you 2011-01-18T11:56:48 stratego is a game i played when i was about 6... there is no way its that complicated 2011-01-18T11:58:43 jmcarthur: yes pls, lol 2011-01-18T11:58:47 let's do aurora 2011-01-18T12:00:39 jmcarthur: when i talk about rules being complicated i think of rules that need to take care of lots of edge cases... for example in some of the ant games. 2011-01-18T12:01:29 while i consider both chess and stratego to have simple rules... so does go for that matter 2011-01-18T12:02:12 they are "complicated" games --i would say stratego has simpler rules than chess.. just because it took me while to understand knights 2011-01-18T12:03:09 But some dude thats hot/cold ---mmm. Sounds more like a tron obsession. 2011-01-18T12:04:13 *** dr`tmp has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6) 2011-01-18T12:05:43 delt0r___: i was agreeing with you that the various unit types don't complicate things unnecessarily 2011-01-18T12:05:52 right 2011-01-18T12:06:23 delt0r___: and stratego's "move units one square at a time" rule is *far* simpler than chess's "each unit moves differently" rules 2011-01-18T12:06:34 well in stratego in particular the idea that there's lots of unit types is a bit miss leading. 2011-01-18T12:06:58 there are only two kinds of movement in the variant i have in mind, three in the real version 2011-01-18T12:07:04 jmcarthur: agree -chess has more complex rules... 2011-01-18T12:07:07 move one square at a time, don't move at all 2011-01-18T12:07:15 and in the real version scouts can move more than one 2011-01-18T12:07:25 and no diagonal movment 2011-01-18T12:08:06 right 2011-01-18T12:08:32 and really these are so simple that they are more like mechanics than rules 2011-01-18T12:08:35 thou in this version souuts are kinda useless. I did like begin able to use a scout ... to well scout 2011-01-18T12:08:57 gotta eat. be back in a few 2011-01-18T12:09:10 well if a bunch of 6 year olds could play stratego --i say its simple enough 2011-01-18T12:25:25 Here I found a shareware version where the scout can attack on it's move: http://www.windowsgames.co.uk/thegeneral.html 2011-01-18T12:30:03 all modern version use this rule 2011-01-18T12:31:43 delt0r___: i think amstan_i and i are talking about how simple it would be to implement, not how simple it is for humans to understand. in either case, i disagree with amstan_i about how complicated stratego is 2011-01-18T12:32:13 he hasn't even looked up the rules 2011-01-18T12:32:20 :( 2011-01-18T12:32:42 amstan_i: you should look up the rules. they are very simple 2011-01-18T12:35:04 Yeah at first I was overwhelmed with all the military ranks, but in the end units '1' to '7' are all equal! Only '8', '9' and the Spy are special. 2011-01-18T12:35:52 8 can defeat bombs, 9 can walk any number of squares in one direction and the spy can kill '1'. 2011-01-18T12:36:59 oh yes, bombs are special too of course, they cannot move and kill anything but '8'. 2011-01-18T12:38:03 in my code i actually define them in this order: Bomb, Marshal, General, Colonel, ..., Miner, Scout, Spy, Flag. that allows me to only have to say explicitly that miners beat bombs and spies beat marshals, then all the others fall out from their ranks naturally 2011-01-18T12:38:20 and for movement i only treat bombs and flags as special, of course 2011-01-18T12:38:47 and the scout maybe. you are right, ordered like this it is even simpler 2011-01-18T12:39:07 so my fighting code only cares about three cases 2011-01-18T12:39:22 miner vs. bomb, spy vs. marshal, and anything vs. anything 2011-01-18T12:41:58 *** tapwater has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T12:55:50 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2011-01-18T12:59:35 *** Naktibalda has quit IRC (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716]) 2011-01-18T13:03:36 *** dr- has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T13:18:01 *** dr- has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2011-01-18T13:24:48 *** choas has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T13:30:53 the only thing is that a half decent starter pack bot will not be so easy--or at least not so small 2011-01-18T13:30:58 codewise that is 2011-01-18T13:44:33 *** perror has quit IRC (Quit: Bye all !) 2011-01-18T13:47:40 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T13:54:00 *** boegel has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T14:02:26 *** boegel has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T14:16:23 *** boegel has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T14:24:05 *** dr`away has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T14:29:52 *** dr`away has quit IRC (Quit: Coyote finally caught me) 2011-01-18T14:35:48 i think it could be 2011-01-18T14:35:58 depends on what you call "decent" i guess 2011-01-18T14:48:01 well there is always "random" 2011-01-18T14:48:05 and "rage" 2011-01-18T14:48:22 rage just attacks with everything it can 2011-01-18T14:48:44 smart rage could at least use miners on mines once discovered 2011-01-18T15:03:33 rage could track units and simply attack those units as aggressively as possible and only with units that can beat them 2011-01-18T15:03:47 and for units that are unknown just attack with whatever 2011-01-18T15:04:03 it's more complex than rage in the past, i agree 2011-01-18T15:04:59 could ignore things like path finding though, for simplicity. if an effective unit can't magically find its way to a weak opponent unit, just allow it to get hung up 2011-01-18T15:05:38 i think it would still be formidible enough to be a strong bot for testing against, initially 2011-01-18T15:20:29 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T15:21:39 *** delt0r___ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-01-18T15:24:07 *** boegel has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-01-18T15:28:40 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2011-01-18T15:43:26 *** boegel has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T15:52:04 *** Error323 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2011-01-18T15:55:13 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T15:58:25 *** Error323 has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T16:04:13 *** dr`test has joined #aichallenge 2011-01-18T16:05:25 *** sigh has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-01-18T16:10:06 *** atriplez has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2011-01-18T16:13:18 *** rebelxt