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2011-03-23T01:57:29  <antimatroid> ergh
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2011-03-23T01:57:36  <antimatroid> anyone around with some c++ knowledge?
2011-03-23T01:57:54  <McLeopold> how little knowledge?
2011-03-23T01:58:44  <antimatroid> i can't work out how to write my virtual io functions
2011-03-23T01:59:58  <McLeopold> do you have something in your github?
2011-03-23T02:00:17  <antimatroid> no, i have a smaller sample file
2011-03-23T02:00:24  <antimatroid> i'm just cleaning it into 1 file so i can pastebin it
2011-03-23T02:03:29  <McLeopold> I assume you're doing your fancy << and >> operator stuff in an abstract class?
2011-03-23T02:03:53  <antimatroid> i want them to be virtual functions
2011-03-23T02:04:03  <antimatroid> but i can't have virtual friend functions
2011-03-23T02:04:55  <antimatroid> ergh, codepad is annoying about where it wants ';'s
2011-03-23T02:05:04  <antimatroid> http://codepad.org/thV6Nk9a
2011-03-23T02:05:17  <antimatroid> there we go, i want the output at the bottom to be 1 1 1 twice
2011-03-23T02:06:22  <janzert> operator<<(std::ostream &os, NGame<I> &game) != operator<<(std::ostream &os, Game &game)
2011-03-23T02:06:46  <antimatroid> janzert: how do i make them virtual?
2011-03-23T02:07:00  <antimatroid> i can't work out how to do the operator<< inside the class without friend
2011-03-23T02:07:02  <antimatroid> basically
2011-03-23T02:07:11  <antimatroid> normally I do it outside the class
2011-03-23T02:07:14  <janzert> it won't let you add virtual keyword?
2011-03-23T02:07:41  <antimatroid> claims you can't have a function that is a virtual and a friend function
2011-03-23T02:07:50  <antimatroid> or claims << needs to take exactly one parameter
2011-03-23T02:07:55  <antimatroid> and doesn't like me just passing os :\
2011-03-23T02:08:24  <janzert> actually yeah, how are you going to pass a second argument to it?
2011-03-23T02:08:34  <janzert> it's a binary operator
2011-03-23T02:09:15  <antimatroid> normally i do "ostream& operator<<(ostream &os, const Game &game);"
2011-03-23T02:09:30  <antimatroid> then "os << game" puts game into os and returns a reference to os
2011-03-23T02:09:34  <antimatroid> so you can compose them
2011-03-23T02:09:55  <antimatroid> similarly with input streams
2011-03-23T02:10:03  <janzert> ok, obviously I don't use it
2011-03-23T02:10:19  <antimatroid> it makes io very nice
2011-03-23T02:10:36  * janzert hates the overloading c++ does of << to do that
2011-03-23T02:10:45  <antimatroid> i only use them for io
2011-03-23T02:10:48  <janzert> I sure don't add to it any more than it already has:)
2011-03-23T02:11:04  <janzert> but anyway
2011-03-23T02:11:28  <janzert> I'd try just making a regular function virtual in the way you want and get that working first
2011-03-23T02:11:43  <antimatroid> i have, the print one :P
2011-03-23T02:11:45  <janzert> then go back to make it into an operator
2011-03-23T02:12:10  <antimatroid> there are two functions there, one works for virtuals like a print function, but i REALLY want the <</>> operators, plus I use operators in other places
2011-03-23T02:12:39  <janzert> oh yeah, I see
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2011-03-23T02:12:50  <janzert> make your method signature in the second class the same as the first
2011-03-23T02:12:58  <janzert> then try making it virtual
2011-03-23T02:13:08  <antimatroid> signature?
2011-03-23T02:13:34  <antimatroid> i can't take one parameter to << without it being friend, and i can't pass os to it without that :\
2011-03-23T02:13:39  <janzert> have it take the Game class as the second argument not NGame<I>
2011-03-23T02:13:39  <antimatroid> i'm thinking maybe this just isn't possible
2011-03-23T02:13:40  <McLeopold> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/More_C%2B%2B_Idioms/Virtual_Friend_Function
2011-03-23T02:13:48  <antimatroid> hmm okay
2011-03-23T02:14:21  <janzert> ahh, McLeopold's got it :
2011-03-23T02:14:23  <janzert> :)
2011-03-23T02:14:34  <antimatroid> if i do that it wont compile, because it thinks the Game parameter is an actual game
2011-03-23T02:15:04  <antimatroid> ah okay, messy but that should do it
2011-03-23T02:15:07  <janzert> look at McLeopold's link, the example is exactly what you want
2011-03-23T02:15:12  <antimatroid> ye
2011-03-23T02:15:14  <antimatroid> yep*
2011-03-23T02:15:16  <janzert> basically it needs a trampoline
2011-03-23T02:15:29  <antimatroid> is this going to be slow as hell?
2011-03-23T02:15:38  <antimatroid> this is meant to be for a game theory library :P
2011-03-23T02:15:52  <antimatroid> and atm it's fairly fast
2011-03-23T02:16:15  <janzert> with an optimized build I don't think it should be any slower than a straight virtual function
2011-03-23T02:16:24  <janzert> the trampoline method should get inlined
2011-03-23T02:16:25  <McLeopold> Why does it even need to be a friend?
2011-03-23T02:16:39  <antimatroid> McLeopold: to take two parameters
2011-03-23T02:17:03  <antimatroid> are virtual functions lots slower than normal functions?
2011-03-23T02:17:22  <janzert> they just take an extra level of indirection to call
2011-03-23T02:17:37  <antimatroid> i should be alright
2011-03-23T02:17:38  <janzert> basically an extra pointer lookup
2011-03-23T02:17:47  <antimatroid> i'll set up a test before i change it and check again once i've updated stuff
2011-03-23T02:17:55  <McLeopold> It's basically a lookup in a master table of object classes to find the real class, I think.
2011-03-23T02:18:18  <antimatroid> i better need to write more than an engine class for games generally :\
2011-03-23T02:18:52  <antimatroid> atm it's just so i can make an engine as Engine<Utility> rather than Engine<Game, Strategy, Utility>
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2011-03-23T02:30:07  <antimatroid> it's a bit messy but it works, cheers :)
2011-03-23T02:30:11  <antimatroid> http://codepad.org/n3KuR7ch
2011-03-23T02:30:15  <antimatroid> that's the result
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2011-03-23T02:34:56  <antimatroid> janzert: turns out it's not sufficient to say a 2 player simultaneous game isn't symmetric if the payoff matrices aren't transposes
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2011-03-23T02:35:30  <antimatroid> anywhere i had always read the definition had made that sound like it was the case
2011-03-23T02:36:46  <antimatroid> eg: make a symmetric 2x2 game from 14;23, then swap player one's strategies for an equivalent game, the payoff matrices are no longer transposes
2011-03-23T02:36:58  <antimatroid> 1,4;2,3
2011-03-23T02:37:20  <McLeopold> antimatroid: those 2 print functions are really needed, right?
2011-03-23T02:37:38  <antimatroid> McLeopold: if you can get that to work without them i would do it without
2011-03-23T02:37:40  <antimatroid> but i don't see how
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2011-03-23T02:41:18  <McLeopold> what is your compile command?
2011-03-23T02:42:00  <antimatroid> you should just be able to compile that file
2011-03-23T02:42:10  <antimatroid> i use code::blocks, so all that is done for me :P
2011-03-23T02:42:20  <McLeopold> If I reduce the loop to 1, I get just "1 1 1"
2011-03-23T02:42:27  <McLeopold> didn't you want 2 lines?
2011-03-23T02:42:37  <antimatroid> no, i took the first print function out
2011-03-23T02:42:46  <antimatroid> oh, yeah sorry about keeping that loop :P
2011-03-23T02:43:33  <McLeopold> so the magic is "cout << game << end1;"
2011-03-23T02:43:46  <McLeopold> endl
2011-03-23T02:44:00  <antimatroid> yeah
2011-03-23T02:44:04  <antimatroid> and picking the right function
2011-03-23T02:44:34  <antimatroid> basically i want to do this so I can have Game and Strategy as parents to all games with those things, and write the engine to be like Strategy = game.newStrategy();
2011-03-23T02:44:50  <antimatroid> but to have Game i also need to have the operators work
2011-03-23T02:47:41  <McLeopold> so, it will be more than just outputting a game class as a string?
2011-03-23T02:48:03  <antimatroid> well, it makes it a string
2011-03-23T02:48:12  <antimatroid> but if i do print() i can't compose
2011-03-23T02:48:50  <McLeopold> if you had the operator overloader just on the base, couldn't it call a toString function and get the right version?
2011-03-23T02:49:22  <antimatroid> hmm, i can't probably make all functions work the same way by making them call print
2011-03-23T02:49:30  <antimatroid> hang on
2011-03-23T02:50:11  <antimatroid> yeah, i should swap the << and print functions for NGame
2011-03-23T02:50:33  <antimatroid> although if I do it this way, when using NGames i'm not using a virtual function
2011-03-23T02:51:00  <McLeopold> is that bad?
2011-03-23T02:51:15  <antimatroid> depends how bad virtual functions are considered in libraries
2011-03-23T02:51:20  <antimatroid> i intend for this to be open source
2011-03-23T02:51:45  <antimatroid> hopefully i get far enough to set up a gui with network support so people can play games themselves or against bots, both locally and networked
2011-03-23T02:51:54  <antimatroid> it's meant for academic stuff
2011-03-23T02:52:55  <antimatroid> once i learn haskell properly i can see myself doing a rewrite though
2011-03-23T02:54:27  <McLeopold> Hmm, with your method you avoid string building in memory and just put to the output stream as soon as possible.
2011-03-23T02:54:51  <antimatroid> yes, i would always pass an ostream to the print function
2011-03-23T02:55:40  <antimatroid> https://github.com/antimatroid/GTL/blob/master/ngame/NGame.h
2011-03-23T02:55:45  <antimatroid> that's my actual ngame file at present
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2011-03-23T03:04:21  <McLeopold> antimatroid: I think you should learn lisp so you can write domain specific languages with the macros.
2011-03-23T03:05:33  <antimatroid> McLeopold: possibly, can the same sort of thing be done with haskell?
2011-03-23T03:06:35  <McLeopold> Probably, but I don't know for sure.  And there is the type system, so lisp would be faster to learn.
2011-03-23T03:06:45  <McLeopold> I'm learning lisp now, haskell is next.
2011-03-23T03:07:06  <antimatroid> haskell has an awesome type system
2011-03-23T03:07:10  <McLeopold> c++ was 12 years ago, so I'm over that. :P
2011-03-23T03:07:20  <antimatroid> i've been learning haskell very slowly, i was reading through real world haskell the other day
2011-03-23T03:07:33  <antimatroid> i haven't ruled out going into algo trading
2011-03-23T03:07:47  <antimatroid> so it would be good if i knew a lot of c++, plus i like it before it gets messy
2011-03-23T03:10:40  <McLeopold> I'm thinking of pickup up straight c again, just for the speed.
2011-03-23T03:11:04  <McLeopold> I'm really anti OOP
2011-03-23T03:11:32  <antimatroid> i don't think i'm experienced enough to really judge on that one
2011-03-23T03:11:37  <antimatroid> (like that's ever stopped me before :P)
2011-03-23T03:13:32  <McLeopold> judge what?
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2011-03-23T03:13:37  <McLeopold> if you like OOP?
2011-03-23T03:14:21  <antimatroid> being anti it
2011-03-23T03:14:27  <McLeopold> oh
2011-03-23T03:14:30  <antimatroid> i haven't really had much exposure to anything else
2011-03-23T03:14:44  <McLeopold> well, it's nice when stuff is packaged for you and it just works
2011-03-23T03:14:45  <antimatroid> i really like the idea of being able to pass functions around like variables
2011-03-23T03:15:01  <McLeopold> but when you are building your own program, sometimes it just gets in the way
2011-03-23T03:15:28  <McLeopold> If I find myself jumping through hoops to do simple tasks, I don't like it.
2011-03-23T03:15:56  <antimatroid> that's what i think
2011-03-23T03:16:11  <antimatroid> and hence gave me a bit of a downer when i looked up how to do sieve for primes in haskell
2011-03-23T03:16:24  <McLeopold> I read the head first design pattern book and threw up
2011-03-23T03:17:21  <McLeopold> A prime sieve seems like it would be imperative code.  Was the example in the functional style?
2011-03-23T03:18:23  <antimatroid> http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Prime_numbers
2011-03-23T03:18:31  <antimatroid> see that page, the first example is alright, but slow as hell
2011-03-23T03:22:33  <McLeopold> I just don't get haskell.
2011-03-23T03:23:58  <antimatroid> i don't yet, but it's slowly making more sense, i haven't really put a huge amount of effort in yet though either
2011-03-23T03:24:21  <antimatroid> real world haskell seems a lot better than learn you a haskell
2011-03-23T03:26:22  <McLeopold> I was reading learn you a haskell, should I switch?
2011-03-23T03:26:31  <McLeopold> And remember, I hate math notation. :P
2011-03-23T03:28:04  <antimatroid> yes
2011-03-23T03:28:13  <antimatroid> at least give it a look
2011-03-23T03:28:30  <antimatroid> http://book.realworldhaskell.org/read/
2011-03-23T03:30:00  <McLeopold> json and barcode, oh my
2011-03-23T03:30:26  <McLeopold> But no colorful pictures of indistinguishable animals. :(
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2011-03-23T03:30:53  <antimatroid> i know
2011-03-23T03:31:06  <antimatroid> i was unsure at first, learn you a haskell is entertaining, but it's so damn confusing
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2011-03-23T04:51:24  <antimatroid> nah, i'm starting to lose a fair bit of speed doing this
2011-03-23T04:51:35  <antimatroid> and it's just messy, i'm just going to pass extra templates
2011-03-23T05:11:10  <sigh> antimatroid: I heard some discussion about doing more than 1 damage
2011-03-23T05:11:16  <sigh> did anything come out of that?
2011-03-23T05:11:37  <antimatroid> sigh: unsure, it works better in some places and not others
2011-03-23T05:11:51  <sigh> damage 2 is too high
2011-03-23T05:11:58  <antimatroid> it's easy for one ant to kill two then, and a.b.c (my favourite example) gives all three dead
2011-03-23T05:12:14  <sigh> 1.5?
2011-03-23T05:12:31  <antimatroid> okay, i'll do some examples
2011-03-23T05:13:04  <sigh> either way, the only values worth looking for are in the range [1, 2)
2011-03-23T05:13:05  <sigh> imo
2011-03-23T05:13:20  <antimatroid> i agree
2011-03-23T05:13:55  <antimatroid> you present the problem of having to pass rationals to players then
2011-03-23T05:14:10  <sigh> nope, just scale up damage and hp
2011-03-23T05:14:16  <antimatroid> but we can just make the parameter "damage num denom"
2011-03-23T05:14:18  <sigh> 1.5 is 2 hp, 3 damage
2011-03-23T05:14:23  <antimatroid> yeah okay
2011-03-23T05:15:21  <sigh> and pass it to them as damage/hp :P
2011-03-23T05:15:36  <antimatroid> yep
2011-03-23T05:15:51  <antimatroid> i think damage is the way to go
2011-03-23T05:15:59  <antimatroid> it makes sense to say the ants dish out damage in battle
2011-03-23T05:16:11  <sigh> yes
2011-03-23T05:16:31  <sigh> given that ants can't choose who to attack, this makes most sense
2011-03-23T05:16:57  <antimatroid> if we do 1.5, two ants can kill 3
2011-03-23T05:17:10  <sigh> of course
2011-03-23T05:17:14  <antimatroid> you can block 1 width corridors in the very worst of cases, but i really don't care about tat
2011-03-23T05:17:24  <sigh> if you do d/h then h ants can kill d
2011-03-23T05:17:46  <antimatroid> yeah, i know the fact is obvious, just noting the fact :)
2011-03-23T05:18:26  <sigh> I like damage = 1 unless proven otherwise
2011-03-23T05:21:58  <antimatroid> i think i do too
2011-03-23T05:22:02  <antimatroid> 2 ants kill 3 doesn't make sense
2011-03-23T05:22:08  <antimatroid> not for what we're going for
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2011-03-23T05:24:07  <antimatroid> sigh: it seems to work a bit more like power in some of the examples i put on wiki
2011-03-23T05:25:14  <antimatroid> not right now, but i think we should push to lock damage =1 in by this time next week
2011-03-23T05:25:34  <antimatroid> it's too confusing having so many different options for things
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2011-03-23T05:40:59  <Stocha> In 4 games, i had my most advanced bot clearly behind in term of game won, compared to the other three challengers (whom were at a tie)
2011-03-23T05:41:23  <Stocha> but against one of those challenger, the advanced bot proved to considerably stronger on 1vs1.
2011-03-23T05:41:41  <antimatroid> with what rules?
2011-03-23T05:41:49  <Stocha> having 33% to50% more wins
2011-03-23T05:41:50  <antimatroid> and when you say advanced, surely it's not very smart with battles
2011-03-23T05:42:06  <Stocha> i used the radius2=4 X=1_10 for this particular comparison
2011-03-23T05:42:14  <Stocha> food spawnradius=1
2011-03-23T05:42:27  <Stocha> ant die on same square also is son
2011-03-23T05:42:39  <Stocha> the map was 100x100 40% ground
2011-03-23T05:42:43  <antimatroid> use x=1, radius2 =6, spawn2 = 2, view2 = 93
2011-03-23T05:42:47  <Stocha> (in both 4 and 2 players)
2011-03-23T05:43:08  <Stocha> i'll do that. But it won't change the results :)
2011-03-23T05:43:09  <antimatroid> radius2 == attack2
2011-03-23T05:43:23  <antimatroid> ... and what is your bot doing that's so much smarter about battles?
2011-03-23T05:43:40  <Stocha> he gathers its troops before attacking
2011-03-23T05:43:43  <antimatroid> if it's stupidly running into bots as fast as possible without any real thought to it, it doesn't really surprise me that they lose
2011-03-23T05:43:52  <Stocha> when the other shoot lonely drone at random
2011-03-23T05:44:18  <antimatroid> have you run it on symmetric maps with symmetric spawning?
2011-03-23T05:44:21  <Stocha> the game are available on the link i provided on the forum (thread exotic rules)
2011-03-23T05:44:28  <Stocha> so you might judge by yourself i guess.
2011-03-23T05:44:45  <Stocha> it's assymetric map, but that doesn't change the result.
2011-03-23T05:44:52  <antimatroid> use symmetric
2011-03-23T05:44:54  <antimatroid> with symmetric spawning
2011-03-23T05:44:59  <antimatroid> it's implemented in the python engine
2011-03-23T05:45:02  <antimatroid> you should really be using that
2011-03-23T05:45:06  <Stocha> i have no algorithms for symetric map at the moment
2011-03-23T05:45:11  <antimatroid> use my maps
2011-03-23T05:45:15  <Stocha> i could if you provide me the java version :p
2011-03-23T05:45:30  <Stocha> at the moment i just can't use anything else in my prototype.
2011-03-23T05:45:31  <antimatroid> use the examples i posted in the forums
2011-03-23T05:45:47  <antimatroid> you should at least be using the same io and map formats as the current engine
2011-03-23T05:45:48  <Stocha> i have played like 4000 games
2011-03-23T05:45:53  <Stocha> can you provide me 4000 maps ?
2011-03-23T05:46:16  <Stocha> yeah. it would be good to do thoses testing with your map generator
2011-03-23T05:46:22  <Stocha> but i have no java version of it.
2011-03-23T05:46:45  <Stocha> at some point, i may make one myself, of find a way to use the python script one way or another.
2011-03-23T05:46:45  <antimatroid> http://pastebin.com/HA6EfpUm
2011-03-23T05:46:49  <antimatroid> see there for symmetric maps
2011-03-23T05:47:02  <antimatroid> just install python
2011-03-23T05:47:25  <Stocha> i have also to be able to call non java modules and to interface them
2011-03-23T05:47:35  <Stocha> at the moment i use only java to java interfaces
2011-03-23T05:48:02  <Stocha> so that won't happen until some weeks from now. At this point i hope we'll have better data available than my own testings :p
2011-03-23T05:48:37  <Stocha> Otherwise we just need a java implementation i can paste into my framework
2011-03-23T05:49:00  <antimatroid> you're welcome to rewrite it
2011-03-23T05:49:08  <antimatroid> i'm not touching java with a ten foot pole
2011-03-23T05:49:11  <antimatroid> nor do i have the time
2011-03-23T05:49:22  <sigh> antimatroid: btw, can you clean up the ants/maps directory and add proper maps, and take out invalid ones and such
2011-03-23T05:49:33  <antimatroid> sigh: sure
2011-03-23T05:49:46  <antimatroid> well, at some point tonight
2011-03-23T05:50:04  <sigh> no worries, I think it is important now that random people are looking at the repo
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2011-03-23T05:50:14  <antimatroid> yeah
2011-03-23T05:50:30  <antimatroid> there's some pages that I don't really know what to do with until we've started packaging things
2011-03-23T05:50:33  <antimatroid> like the quickstart guides
2011-03-23T05:50:39  <sigh> also update play_one_game.* to use a reasonable default map
2011-03-23T05:50:43  <antimatroid> and i don't really want to touch tutorials with the rules still so vague
2011-03-23T05:50:48  <sigh> :)
2011-03-23T05:50:50  <sigh> yeah
2011-03-23T05:51:03  <antimatroid> play_one_game?
2011-03-23T05:53:19  <sigh> ants/play_one_game.sh and ants/play_one_game.md
2011-03-23T05:56:49  <antimatroid> ah yeah okay
2011-03-23T06:05:26  <antimatroid> sigh: the bots aren't even there for those files anymore
2011-03-23T06:05:48  <sigh> they should be, I updated them
2011-03-23T06:05:59  <sigh> last night
2011-03-23T06:06:00  <antimatroid> i just pulled :\
2011-03-23T06:06:32  <antimatroid> ah, nevermind, the directory has changed
2011-03-23T06:06:46  <sigh> :P
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2011-03-23T06:09:36  <antimatroid> what should i use for map naming?
2011-03-23T06:09:57  <antimatroid> egsymmetric*.txt?
2011-03-23T06:10:00  <sigh> up to you
2011-03-23T06:10:11  <sigh> yay for egg symmetry
2011-03-23T06:11:24  <antimatroid> i'm hoping someone comes in and makes a 3d viewer on a torus :P
2011-03-23T06:12:43  <antimatroid> nothing against frontiers, it's awesome, just that'd be mega
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2011-03-23T06:24:03  <antimatroid> sigh: are the .png maps going?
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2011-03-23T06:24:17  <antimatroid> oh
2011-03-23T06:24:18  <sigh> nfi
2011-03-23T06:24:27  <antimatroid> we've forgotten to add the don't let accoun win feature :P
2011-03-23T06:30:44  <antimatroid> sigh: i haven't written a shell script in like 4 years
2011-03-23T06:30:57  <sigh> why do you need to write a shell script?
2011-03-23T06:30:58  <antimatroid> want to write a make_symmetric_maps.sh file for me?
2011-03-23T06:31:09  <antimatroid> otherwise what's an easy way to make x maps?
2011-03-23T06:31:22  <sigh> how do you make a map?
2011-03-23T06:31:33  <antimatroid> there is an object that can make them for you
2011-03-23T06:31:41  <antimatroid> otherwise it defaults to just making and printing one
2011-03-23T06:31:50  <sigh> paste command to make a map
2011-03-23T06:32:08  <antimatroid> python symmetric_mapgen.py :P
2011-03-23T06:32:41  <sigh> that will generate a different map each time?
2011-03-23T06:32:44  <antimatroid> yes
2011-03-23T06:32:57  <sigh> and output to stdout?
2011-03-23T06:33:03  <antimatroid> yes
2011-03-23T06:33:23  <sigh> for i in {1..20}; do python symmetric_mapgen.py > map_$i.txt; done
2011-03-23T06:34:24  <antimatroid> :)
2011-03-23T06:38:28  <antimatroid> what chmod -? do i want?
2011-03-23T06:39:20  <sigh> chmod changes the permissions on the file
2011-03-23T06:39:45  <sigh> what are you chmoding?
2011-03-23T06:40:24  <antimatroid> make_symmetric_maps.sh
2011-03-23T06:41:02  <sigh> chmod a+x make_symmetric_maps.sh is fine
2011-03-23T06:41:22  <sigh> give any execute privilages for the script
2011-03-23T06:44:40  <sigh> *give anyone
2011-03-23T06:52:20  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Nick Ham epsilon * r783c8e0 / (6 files): removed invalid map files - http://bit.ly/efG8nT
2011-03-23T06:52:21  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Nick Ham epsilon * rb85a0b9 / (ants/mapgen/symmetric_mapgen.py ants/maps/simple1.txt): cleaned up maps - http://bit.ly/gOSAid
2011-03-23T06:53:08  <antimatroid> i haven't changed the play game files yet
2011-03-23T06:53:14  <antimatroid> but there are 200 symmetric maps now :P
2011-03-23T06:54:12  <sigh> :P
2011-03-23T06:54:15  <antimatroid> except they didn't show :\
2011-03-23T07:00:16  <sigh> git you git add them?
2011-03-23T07:00:21  <sigh> did you
2011-03-23T07:00:34  <antimatroid> i did
2011-03-23T07:01:25  <antimatroid> "The following paths are ignored by one of your .gitignore files:" ?
2011-03-23T07:01:31  <antimatroid> then lists all the file locations
2011-03-23T07:01:40  <sigh> what did you name the files?
2011-03-23T07:01:40  <antimatroid> when i try to do git add *.txt inside the actual folder
2011-03-23T07:01:48  <antimatroid> symmetric_map_n.txt
2011-03-23T07:02:16  <sigh> wtf, what is that .gitignore file doing there
2011-03-23T07:02:18  <sigh> remove it
2011-03-23T07:02:33  <sigh> oh, also... don't put 200 maps for now
2011-03-23T07:02:36  <sigh> put like 10
2011-03-23T07:02:49  <sigh> no point cluttering up the map directory, just enough for examples
2011-03-23T07:02:58  <antimatroid> i don't know what the gitignore file is
2011-03-23T07:03:25  <sigh> just `rm .gitignore` in that directory
2011-03-23T07:03:55  <sigh> don't commit the remove, but we'll ask McLeopold what's up
2011-03-23T07:06:10  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Nick Ham epsilon * ra09ef3b / (22 files in 3 dirs): added example symmetric maps - http://bit.ly/hDP3PI
2011-03-23T07:07:19  <antimatroid> there we go
2011-03-23T07:07:37  <antimatroid> oh sorry :P
2011-03-23T07:07:47  <antimatroid> well it's done now
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2011-03-23T07:08:51  <sigh> don't matter
2011-03-23T07:09:11  <sigh> .gitignore specifies what files git will ignore (suprisingly enough)
2011-03-23T07:09:31  <sigh> for example you would want to ignore *.o files when working with C
2011-03-23T07:09:49  <sigh> I have no idea why McLeopold told git to ignore *.txt and *.png
2011-03-23T07:09:59  <antimatroid> yeah oh well
2011-03-23T07:10:07  <antimatroid> i really like the maps
2011-03-23T07:11:12  <sigh> :)
2011-03-23T07:23:26  <antimatroid> my lecturer had an interesting way of going through the contradiction with the set of all sets today
2011-03-23T07:23:59  <antimatroid> for an example of a set containing itself, let S = {x | x is a set and x is not a hippo}
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2011-03-23T07:28:07  <antimatroid> set of everything**
2011-03-23T07:32:41  <sigh> ok?
2011-03-23T07:33:12  <sigh> most hippos I've seen haven't been sets
2011-03-23T07:33:37  <antimatroid> no
2011-03-23T07:33:46  <antimatroid> the point is S is an element of itself
2011-03-23T07:33:51  <sigh> ok
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2011-03-23T07:34:39  <antimatroid> oh, i think S is meant to be a subset of the set of sets not containing itself
2011-03-23T07:34:41  <antimatroid> my bad :P
2011-03-23T07:34:49  <antimatroid> and then from that you get a contradiction
2011-03-23T07:34:53  <sigh> yes
2011-03-23T07:34:55  <antimatroid> well, wahtever one would call it
2011-03-23T07:35:05  <sigh> where did you get hippo from?
2011-03-23T07:35:18  <antimatroid> that's what my lecturer used as an example of a set containing itself
2011-03-23T07:35:23  <sigh> ahh
2011-03-23T07:36:04  <sigh> the set of all sets not containing itself is a fairly standard example
2011-03-23T07:36:22  <antimatroid> i know, i was referring to the example :P
2011-03-23T07:36:30  <sigh> Russel's Paradox, I think
2011-03-23T07:36:45  <sigh> ah ok
2011-03-23T07:36:45  <antimatroid> i like the pinnocio paradox :P
2011-03-23T07:36:50  <antimatroid> "my nose will grow"
2011-03-23T07:36:50  <sigh> :)
2011-03-23T07:37:04  <Stocha> I have been using one simple rule for years : "if you really needs speed, only use int[] with a single allocation at start of program"
2011-03-23T07:37:11  <antimatroid> well, if you're being anal "my nose will grow as a result of me saying this"
2011-03-23T07:37:23  <sigh> haha
2011-03-23T07:37:32  <Stocha> it works quite well
2011-03-23T07:37:41  <Stocha> but then you don't need speed that often also
2011-03-23T07:37:43  <antimatroid> Stocha: try not using java ;)
2011-03-23T07:37:59  <Stocha> i did the same with c
2011-03-23T07:38:15  <Stocha> c and java are very alike. Java is a c without the macro, when you need speed
2011-03-23T07:38:37  <Stocha> when you don't need the speed java is far superior. More user friendly. Faster to test, good libraries.
2011-03-23T07:38:37  <antimatroid> and without operator overloading? of variable overloading etc.
2011-03-23T07:38:38  <antimatroid> i could not live
2011-03-23T07:38:52  <antimatroid> i dunno if i would call java user friendly
2011-03-23T07:38:53  <Stocha> if you don't need speed you can use them plenty
2011-03-23T07:38:58  <antimatroid> c++ lets me get away with almost anything i want
2011-03-23T07:39:28  <Stocha> c++ is one heavy beast to get going in the right direction :p
2011-03-23T07:39:34  <antimatroid> it is
2011-03-23T07:39:54  <antimatroid> i treated it like c with classes then i'm still learning almost daily
2011-03-23T07:40:03  <Stocha> when i would use c++, i'd rather use java. If i need speed, i'm good with C.
2011-03-23T07:40:47  <Stocha> although i've grown incomfortable at c programming with years passing :'(
2011-03-23T07:40:49  <antimatroid> i'm pretty sick of c++
2011-03-23T07:41:09  <Stocha> does that mean you like it, or that you are fed up with it ?
2011-03-23T07:41:16  <antimatroid> fed up with it
2011-03-23T07:41:31  <Stocha> me too
2011-03-23T07:41:50  <Stocha> i have used it a few time, when i was learning computer science.
2011-03-23T07:42:23  <Stocha> When dinosaures were still a dominant species.
2011-03-23T07:42:28  <antimatroid> it's pretty much all i know atm, i don't particularly like python, hate java
2011-03-23T07:42:33  <antimatroid> it's haskell or lisp
2011-03-23T07:42:46  <Stocha> go with them then.
2011-03-23T07:42:51  <Stocha> what's wrong with that.
2011-03-23T07:43:01  <antimatroid> i am slowly learning haskell
2011-03-23T07:43:04  <antimatroid> it's confusing :P
2011-03-23T07:43:05  <Stocha> maybe you could even fin some job in haskell those days. maybe.
2011-03-23T07:43:21  <antimatroid> i'm not really looking to work as a programmer
2011-03-23T07:43:27  <antimatroid> depending on how interesting the job was
2011-03-23T07:43:30  <Stocha> if haskell is confusing to you, you'd better be off learning java :p
2011-03-23T07:43:40  <antimatroid> i will get haskell eventually
2011-03-23T07:43:54  <Stocha> because there are quite some functionnal style freaks that do that at evening time for a recreation.
2011-03-23T07:44:14  <antimatroid> i expect i would fall into that category
2011-03-23T07:44:20  <antimatroid> freak at home doing stuff for recreation
2011-03-23T07:44:20  <Stocha> and nobody want skilled Haskellers. So they probably have choice when they do :p
2011-03-23T07:44:54  <Stocha> you can go and try scala also
2011-03-23T07:45:08  <Stocha> at least when you give up, you'll have grown a few java skill :p
2011-03-23T07:46:13  <Stocha> c has some ways of overloading functions by the way.
2011-03-23T07:46:28  <Stocha> it's kinda of the only usefull feature of langages objects anyway :p
2011-03-23T07:46:52  <Stocha> so c is practically speaking an object langage :p In that it supports virtuals functions
2011-03-23T07:47:06  <Stocha> (they are called function pointers but well)
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2011-03-23T07:47:14  <antimatroid> i like haskell
2011-03-23T07:47:19  <antimatroid> well, parts
2011-03-23T07:47:22  <Stocha> i don't know haskell
2011-03-23T07:47:28  <antimatroid> i like the structure, i think the syntax is a bit rank sometimes
2011-03-23T07:47:36  <antimatroid> the type system is awesome
2011-03-23T07:47:37  <Stocha> i may have seen a sample hello programs years back.
2011-03-23T07:47:44  <antimatroid> i don't know much beyond the bare basics
2011-03-23T07:48:13  <Stocha> in only know it's been popular. I think i even saw a job options every now and then.
2011-03-23T07:48:35  <antimatroid> people say it's good for doing maths stuff
2011-03-23T07:48:40  <antimatroid> which is my main interest, so yeah :P
2011-03-23T07:48:53  <Stocha> what about mathematica ?
2011-03-23T07:49:05  <antimatroid> rank
2011-03-23T07:49:10  <antimatroid> i like open source
2011-03-23T07:49:14  <Stocha> (is it called that ?) well the mathematical framework everyone is using
2011-03-23T07:49:17  <antimatroid> it means i don't have to pay/pirate
2011-03-23T07:49:23  <antimatroid> mathematica yeah
2011-03-23T07:49:27  <Stocha> yeah me too
2011-03-23T07:49:34  <antimatroid> there's matlab too, but that's mostly for numerical work only
2011-03-23T07:49:56  <Stocha> i think mathematic is good for people that don't want to get involved too deeply in computer achitecture
2011-03-23T07:50:05  <Stocha> wich is really 98% of any programming job :p
2011-03-23T07:50:09  <antimatroid> yeah, i'd rather get involved with sage
2011-03-23T07:50:31  <sigh> then get used to python :P
2011-03-23T07:50:47  <antimatroid> i know :P
2011-03-23T07:50:53  <Stocha> mm, i'll try to go and get going with this new silly bot idea i had. I have like an hour of pause for lunch :p
2011-03-23T07:51:03  <antimatroid> lunch?
2011-03-23T07:51:05  <antimatroid> it's almost 11 pm :P
2011-03-23T07:51:17  <Stocha> no, it's 12:47 am !
2011-03-23T07:51:22  <Stocha> your watch is wrong !
2011-03-23T07:51:27  <antimatroid> pm?
2011-03-23T07:51:33  <Stocha> am !
2011-03-23T07:51:38  <sigh> he's european
2011-03-23T07:51:39  <antimatroid> didn't you say lunch?
2011-03-23T07:51:42  <Stocha> it's lunch time in a word.
2011-03-23T07:51:51  <sigh> hmmm
2011-03-23T07:51:54  <sigh> pm
2011-03-23T07:51:55  <Stocha> isn't lunch at 12:01 am ?
2011-03-23T07:51:58  <Stocha> oh pm
2011-03-23T07:52:00  <Stocha> pm then
2011-03-23T07:52:01  <antimatroid> lol :P
2011-03-23T07:52:05  <antimatroid> i was like wtf
2011-03-23T07:52:09  <Stocha> that's 11:59 am
2011-03-23T07:52:14  <Stocha> then 12:00 pm ?
2011-03-23T07:52:16  <sigh> 12:00 pm
2011-03-23T07:52:17  <sigh> yes
2011-03-23T07:52:17  <Stocha> okay sorry :p
2011-03-23T07:52:26  <antimatroid> you will be..
2011-03-23T07:52:56  <antimatroid> sigh: i don't really get how i'm meant to be cleaning up those play game scripts?
2011-03-23T07:53:00  <sigh> PM stands for post meridiem which means "after noon"
2011-03-23T07:53:09  <antimatroid> didn't know that
2011-03-23T07:53:13  <antimatroid> nor will i tomorrow :p
2011-03-23T07:53:48  <jbroman> And AM is "ante meridiem"
2011-03-23T07:54:13  <sigh> yes
2011-03-23T07:54:31  <sigh> post and ante should be easy to remember
2011-03-23T07:54:51  <sigh> antimatroid: leave them as they are, then
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2011-03-23T07:55:39  <antimatroid> done :P
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2011-03-23T11:31:31  <Stocha> McLeopold : you too are beginning to think c is superior to c++  ? :p   Design patterns ARE a nice idea. I mean who don't use the usefull patterns. What do they call that. Inversion control ? Observer or i don't know what. It's really powerfull. It's also awfully like dead-straight functors.
2011-03-23T11:31:50  <Stocha> And you can do the same with the c langage, having the function pointers.
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2011-03-23T11:41:25  <amstan> i really don't like how c++ does things, you write a ton of header files that do nothing, just so you can call your functions externally
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2011-03-23T11:42:38  <amstan> antimatroid: do we need this? https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/pull/39
2011-03-23T11:45:14  <andy_> It was me who submitted it. not sure if it's really needed but I saw someone here talking about a Java version earlier.. Did it mostly to freshen up my Python reading skills :)
2011-03-23T11:49:28  <amstan> andy_: cool
2011-03-23T11:49:58  <amstan> andy_: how about a mapgen that generates different maps?
2011-03-23T11:50:13  <amstan> andy_: i was thinking of a symmetric map, that's not wrapped
2011-03-23T11:50:24  <amstan> and you could fit 2^k players on it
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2011-03-23T11:50:49  <amstan> you can split it in 2, 4, 8 and so on
2011-03-23T11:53:04  <andy_> yeah I could give that a try
2011-03-23T12:05:36  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan fix-playgame-exit-status * rc28f913 / ants/playgame.py : make playgame.py return 0 when success, and -1 on exception - http://bit.ly/htndOM
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2011-03-23T13:39:01  <andy_> @amstan: I did as you suggested and the results looks something like this http://pastebin.com/TFz9qDqK
2011-03-23T13:39:02  <contestbot> andy_: User error -- Replace user.
2011-03-23T13:39:21  <amstan> andy_: yeah, that's what i was looking at
2011-03-23T13:39:37  <amstan> is that 4 player or 8? looks like 4
2011-03-23T13:39:43  <andy_> its 4
2011-03-23T13:39:52  <andy_> only a first start
2011-03-23T13:39:55  <amstan> you can also make an 8 player one by splitting the diagonals
2011-03-23T13:40:34  <andy_> yeah im not sure how to fit 8 into a square.. 4*2 or 3*3 with empty in the middle?
2011-03-23T13:40:48  <amstan> 4/2 is not symmetric
2011-03-23T13:41:00  <amstan> the 4 guys stuck in the middle will have a harder time
2011-03-23T13:41:08  <amstan> you need 3x3 with a hole
2011-03-23T13:41:30  <andy_> ok, I'll see if I can come up with something good
2011-03-23T13:41:51  <amstan> something like this: http://pastebin.com/9pxBCCRw
2011-03-23T13:42:13  <amstan> basically..  for 4 players you have 2 axes of symmetry(vertical and horizontal)
2011-03-23T13:42:19  <amstan> for 8 players you must add the diagonals
2011-03-23T13:42:39  <amstan> though.. the map should be square or something
2011-03-23T13:42:54  <amstan> the diagonals should have a slope that fits with the grid
2011-03-23T13:42:57  <andy_> ahh. ok I see
2011-03-23T13:43:00  <amstan> so.. either 1/1 or 1/2
2011-03-23T13:43:12  <amstan> 1/2 will yield a map with one dimension twice the other
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2011-03-23T13:43:29  <amstan> wait, that won't be symmetric then
2011-03-23T13:43:39  <amstan> yeah, if you get the diagonals, the map has to be square
2011-03-23T13:44:42  <amstan> andy_: so basically, i wanted more variety for the mapgens, last contest we had one type of maps that was overrepresented
2011-03-23T13:44:47  <amstan> so everything hardcoded their bots
2011-03-23T13:45:49  <amstan> get that mapgen in git and i'll pull it
2011-03-23T13:46:34  <andy_> ok, I don't have time now must rush away. but I'll add it later or tomorrow.
2011-03-23T13:47:15  <amstan> ok, cool
2011-03-23T13:47:28  <amstan> andy_: thanks for helping btw
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2011-03-23T14:04:27  <amstan> contestbot: seen Frontier
2011-03-23T14:04:27  <contestbot> amstan: Frontier was last seen in #aichallenge 15 hours, 26 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: <Frontier> why did i even ask -.-
2011-03-23T14:04:39  <amstan> contestbot: later tell Frontier See https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/issues/40
2011-03-23T14:04:39  <contestbot> amstan: I think that worked...
2011-03-23T14:05:49  <phirenz> such confidence from a bot.
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2011-03-23T14:06:19  <amstan> phirenz: yeah, lol, it's rather humble
2011-03-23T14:07:01  <amstan> contestbot: later tell McLeopold Can you review https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/issues#issue/38 and confirm my fix?
2011-03-23T14:07:01  <contestbot> amstan: OK
2011-03-23T14:35:12  <Frontier> amstan: Map scrolling is in my todo list. I'm currently working on simulating a JavaScript web environment in a Java application so. So far this looks promising. I'm not sure about the speed of execution though. Rendering will be faster than right now in the applet, and it should be ok for the standalone jar, but maybe parsing the replay will take a few seconds. After all I use a JavaScript engine written in Java.
2011-03-23T14:42:14  <Frontier> All the basic, important features are implemented. The meta data is parsed, there are controls, the buttons-don't-show-bug is fixed and the player names have link buttons to the user profile.
2011-03-23T14:43:47  <Frontier> The offline viewer needs some loving though, and the applet is rendering too slow. If I get the visualizer to run inside the Rhino JavaScript engine shipped with Java 6 both I hit two flies with one flap as we say. (Java 6 is from Dec. 2006, I hope everyone has upgraded already :) )
2011-03-23T14:47:33  <amstan> Frontier: so this is supposed to work? http://home.hypertriangle.com/~alex/aichallenge/ants/visualizer/offline.html
2011-03-23T14:48:04  <amstan> i get Error("Expected s, but f found.")
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2011-03-23T14:48:08  <amstan> in both firefox and chrome
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2011-03-23T14:51:04  <amstan> Frontier: maybe this helps: http://pastebin.com/NB1ArpwV
2011-03-23T14:54:08  <Frontier> amstan: i forgot to replace the string in the offline.html with a recent replay.
2011-03-23T14:54:28  <Frontier> the behavoir is actually correct :p
2011-03-23T14:58:57  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * r05c1dde / ants/visualizer/offline.html : visualizer: updated replay sample in offline.html - http://bit.ly/gpDhVZ
2011-03-23T14:58:59  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * rcddc397 / (30 files in 3 dirs): Merge branch 'epsilon' of github.com:aichallenge/aichallenge into epsilon - http://bit.ly/gTqRKy
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2011-03-23T15:04:05  <amstan> Frontier: pretty good
2011-03-23T15:05:14  <Frontier> thx
2011-03-23T15:05:40  <amstan> omg i'm winning!
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2011-03-23T15:06:41  <amstan> oh man, it's much slower in firefox
2011-03-23T15:06:47  <Frontier> that wasn't planned when I put the names there ^^
2011-03-23T15:07:04  <Frontier> Chrome renders with about 100 FPS and Firefox with 27
2011-03-23T15:07:04  <amstan> save doesn't seem to work
2011-03-23T15:07:34  <amstan> and maximize in chrome yields a scrollbar
2011-03-23T15:07:46  <Frontier> It should save the current fullscreen setting. When you reload the page you should be in the same mode as when you saved.
2011-03-23T15:08:05  <amstan> oh
2011-03-23T15:08:19  <Frontier> sometimes i see that scrollbar, too. maybe i should disable them with JavaScript
2011-03-23T15:09:31  <Frontier> amstan: I don't think saving replays in the browser is nice. It is not easy to see how much storage space is in use and would require some gui.
2011-03-23T15:10:09  <amstan> well.. i didn't know what save meant
2011-03-23T15:10:11  <Frontier> I'll change the label on the button to 'save settings' and add some more 'settings'
2011-03-23T15:10:14  <antimatroid> sigh: you don't need a java map gen
2011-03-23T15:10:25  <antimatroid> amstan*
2011-03-23T15:10:44  <amstan> antimatroid: yeah, he started working a a non-wrapping mapgen
2011-03-23T15:10:54  <amstan> antimatroid: [13:35] <andy_> @amstan: I did as you suggested and the results looks something like this http://pastebin.com/TFz9qDqK
2011-03-23T15:14:54  <antimatroid> hmmm okay, i still think it's better when you are surrounded on all sides
2011-03-23T15:14:59  <amstan> interesting what reddit did to our graph: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/graphs/traffic
2011-03-23T15:15:03  <antimatroid> and you can't do symmetric maps with more than 4 players like that
2011-03-23T15:15:18  <amstan> antimatroid:  http://pastebin.com/9pxBCCRw
2011-03-23T15:15:32  <antimatroid> sigh: shh :P
2011-03-23T15:15:38  <antimatroid> but yeha, okay syre
2011-03-23T15:16:10  <amstan> the problem with my link is that my width!=height since i was lazy
2011-03-23T15:16:14  <amstan> so it's not really symmetric
2011-03-23T15:16:22  <antimatroid> my maps don't have width = height
2011-03-23T15:16:25  <antimatroid> not necessarily anyway
2011-03-23T15:16:27  <antimatroid> and they're ysmmetric
2011-03-23T15:16:49  <amstan> your maps... idk if i would call them simmetric
2011-03-23T15:16:52  <amstan> they're more tile based
2011-03-23T15:17:07  <antimatroid> it's a symmetric game
2011-03-23T15:17:16  <antimatroid> each player starts the exact same game
2011-03-23T15:17:57  <amstan> i guess you're using http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Translational_symmetry
2011-03-23T15:21:20  <antimatroid> yep
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2011-03-23T16:20:54  <McLeopold> amstan: the playgame.py fix looks good
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2011-03-23T16:35:17  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan epsilon * re806266 / ants/playgame.py : Merge branch 'fix-playgame-exit-status' into epsilon - http://bit.ly/gCIRSq
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2011-03-23T17:38:13  <Anders____> Hello McLeopold and other
2011-03-23T17:39:20  <Anders____> the other day you showed me your site for planet wars competition
2011-03-23T17:39:31  <Anders____> I wonder how do I get an account?
2011-03-23T17:40:03  <amstan> Anders____: what site
2011-03-23T17:40:46  <Frontier> "the other day" as in 4 months ago?
2011-03-23T17:42:59  <Anders____> this site http://tcp.zeroviz.us/
2011-03-23T17:43:20  <Anders____> it was actually the other day, I am looking for a place to play planet wars
2011-03-23T17:43:23  <amstan> Anders____: oh.. the tcp thing..
2011-03-23T17:43:34  <amstan> Anders____: you don't need an account, the first time you login, creates it
2011-03-23T17:43:40  <Anders____> ah ok
2011-03-23T17:43:42  <amstan> make sure you use the same password after that
2011-03-23T17:43:52  <amstan> first login also sets the password
2011-03-23T17:43:54  <Anders____> I guess that is enough!
2011-03-23T17:47:14  <Anders____> I get :  connect: Permission denied
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2011-03-23T17:48:10  <Anders____> I run       ./tcp tcp.zeroviz.us 995 a1 -p a1a1 ./runjava.sh
2011-03-23T17:51:14  <McLeopold> hi Anders___
2011-03-23T17:51:24  <Anders____> hi
2011-03-23T17:52:57  <McLeopold> I'm looking at it, hold on.
2011-03-23T17:53:39  <McLeopold> Anders___: try once more
2011-03-23T17:53:51  <Anders____> I have no battery left   if  you have some ideas  perhaps you can drop me a line at anders.eriksson@gmail.com   thank you in advance!
2011-03-23T17:53:53  <McLeopold> and you need a colon in your command line
2011-03-23T17:54:08  <McLeopold> wait, no you don't
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2011-03-23T21:36:01  <amstan> McLeopold: ping
2011-03-23T21:36:34  <amstan> McLeopold: doesn't your java one also have a sample bot, it didn't let me compile without including randombot.java
2011-03-23T21:53:50  <McLeopold> hi
2011-03-23T21:54:13  <McLeopold> RandomBot shouldn't be referenced anywhere in MyBot
2011-03-23T21:54:27  <McLeopold> amstan
2011-03-23T21:55:04  <amstan> McLeopold: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/blob/epsilon/ants/dist/starter_bots/java/MyBot.java#L5
2011-03-23T21:56:42  <McLeopold> amstan: my bad, change that to MyBot
2011-03-23T21:58:43  <CIA-33> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan epsilon * r0c7aef7 / (2 files): Removed the randombot dependency for the starter pack - http://bit.ly/gwDaRc
2011-03-23T21:58:44  <amstan> darn
2011-03-23T21:58:50  <amstan> forgot to include java in the commit msg
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