2011-05-04T00:13:41 *** janzert has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T00:17:07 Frontier: are you around? I don't think we talked about everything I wanted to discuss about the replay format 2011-05-04T00:20:53 *** Mathnerd314 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-05-04T00:23:13 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T00:24:57 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T00:26:12 @later tell sigh: it looks like you use the random see at the beginning of multiple round/games in playgame, possibly to provide the same set of seeds to the games. I think this should be moved to a per/game basis 2011-05-04T00:26:12 McLeopold: OK 2011-05-04T00:46:25 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T00:47:09 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T00:56:11 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T00:57:15 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T00:58:48 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T00:59:37 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T01:10:24 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T01:11:50 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T01:35:53 *** Kingpin13 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T01:58:38 *** ahmedhelal has quit IRC (Read error: No route to host) 2011-05-04T01:59:28 *** ahmedhelal has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:00:25 *** MatmaRex has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:00:38 *** MatmaRex has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:07:07 *** antimatroid has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:10:30 *** smellyhippy has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2011-05-04T02:13:06 *** orivej has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:20:01 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2011-05-04T02:20:56 *** orivej has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T02:29:12 is reddit not working again? 2011-05-04T02:31:45 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:36:54 smiley1983: have you seen the video of that kid singing? 2011-05-04T02:36:57 i just watched it, holy shit 2011-05-04T02:37:17 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6Imk_-gypk&feature=player_embedded 2011-05-04T02:41:19 *** smellyhippy has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:41:19 *** smellyhippy has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:43:14 *** needsch has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T02:43:53 McLeopold: watch that video 2011-05-04T02:44:02 kid's ridiculously good 2011-05-04T02:47:10 why me? 2011-05-04T02:47:29 why not :P 2011-05-04T02:50:45 *** aerique has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:14:47 *** needsch has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2011-05-04T03:22:29 *** boegel has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:23:48 *** valtex has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:32:14 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T03:34:14 *** ltriant has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep) 2011-05-04T03:34:34 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:37:11 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:37:59 *** berak has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:39:26 *** McLeopold has left #aichallenge 2011-05-04T03:49:13 *** sigh has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-05-04T04:02:56 *** woudshoo has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T04:19:40 *** Naktibalda has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T04:27:36 *** orivej has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T04:45:19 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T04:56:51 *** Frontier has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-05-04T05:17:08 *** kaemo has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T05:17:25 *** janzert has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T05:19:43 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-05-04T05:21:48 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T05:24:41 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T05:28:51 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T05:30:44 *** delt0r___ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2011-05-04T05:46:59 *** orivej has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T05:53:38 *** berak has quit IRC (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [SeaMonkey 2.0a3/20090223135443]) 2011-05-04T05:57:16 *** orivej has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T06:05:44 *** orivej has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T06:07:41 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T06:08:54 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T06:13:52 *** Eruonen has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T06:17:49 pls 2011-05-04T06:17:51 pls 2011-05-04T06:17:52 pretty pls 2011-05-04T06:17:59 use var COLOR_WATER = '#CFF'; in the visualizer 2011-05-04T06:18:29 its soo much nicer this way 2011-05-04T06:18:47 i can make out the bots at last 2011-05-04T06:35:33 are you colour blind too? 2011-05-04T06:39:05 *** kaemo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T06:41:26 *** needsch has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T07:04:47 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T07:13:56 huh? 2011-05-04T07:14:08 antimatroid: whats the clock there? 2011-05-04T07:14:23 or time 2011-05-04T07:14:28 yeah possibly time 2011-05-04T07:16:08 9 16pm :P 2011-05-04T07:16:12 mcstar: what about there? 2011-05-04T07:16:22 13:15 2011-05-04T07:16:36 i'm from the future 2011-05-04T07:16:44 haha 2011-05-04T07:16:51 mcstar: watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6Imk_-gypk&feature=player_embedded 2011-05-04T07:16:55 it's ridiculously good 2011-05-04T07:16:57 for what it is 2011-05-04T07:17:05 hey what do u mean im color blind? 2011-05-04T07:17:16 dont tell me that dark blue water doesnt bother you 2011-05-04T07:17:34 i haven't noticed sorry :p 2011-05-04T07:17:40 jaycobcoleman is colourblind 2011-05-04T07:17:40 heh 2011-05-04T07:17:44 i thought you might have been another 2011-05-04T07:17:45 really? 2011-05-04T07:17:48 yeah 2011-05-04T07:17:52 no im not 2011-05-04T07:17:57 i've come across a few colourblind people in my time 2011-05-04T07:17:58 but its too dark 2011-05-04T07:18:03 i don't think it's that big of an issue 2011-05-04T07:18:14 anyway, i cant use it :) 2011-05-04T07:18:18 so i changed 2011-05-04T07:18:29 funniest is people who honestly wonder how colour blind people work out when to go at the traffic lights 2011-05-04T07:18:45 i have actually dumbfounded some people by pointing out that they'd just know the order of the lights 2011-05-04T07:18:47 well, theres shape and position not only color 2011-05-04T07:18:47 errrr 2011-05-04T07:19:35 seriously??? 2011-05-04T07:19:43 the got talent show??? 2011-05-04T07:20:05 ok ill watch beacuse u ask me 2011-05-04T07:20:51 it's worth watching 2011-05-04T07:20:53 i don't watch the show 2011-05-04T07:20:57 but holy shit 2011-05-04T07:21:32 wheres queensland? 2011-05-04T07:22:47 top right state of australia 2011-05-04T07:22:53 ur wither gonna be amazing or dreadful, both i will enjoy 2011-05-04T07:22:56 haha 2011-05-04T07:23:09 w->e 2011-05-04T07:23:55 *** orivej has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T07:25:30 ok 2011-05-04T07:25:34 ive got shivers 2011-05-04T07:25:43 nice 2011-05-04T07:25:55 you know whats the problem though? 2011-05-04T07:26:20 the kid is very young 2011-05-04T07:26:25 yeah, balls haven't dropped 2011-05-04T07:26:37 i don't like the show or the music, but dayamn 2011-05-04T07:26:38 and now he can naturally sing loudly, and the higher pitches almost perfectly 2011-05-04T07:26:57 but hes in puberty 2011-05-04T07:27:02 and all this may change 2011-05-04T07:27:29 good luck for him 2011-05-04T07:29:36 antimatroid: would you watch this? 2011-05-04T07:29:38 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07VatCnhyos 2011-05-04T07:29:46 similar show 2011-05-04T07:29:56 but in hungarian so u wont understand it 2011-05-04T07:30:12 but im curious about what are youre impressions 2011-05-04T07:30:16 ok? 2011-05-04T07:30:30 i'm probably not a good judge of these things but sure 2011-05-04T07:31:23 it sort of sounds funny in places when i don't understand the lyrics :P 2011-05-04T07:31:31 he is talented though 2011-05-04T07:32:04 now's when you tell me that's you :P 2011-05-04T07:33:30 he seems like a sad man 2011-05-04T07:33:35 and wtf is that whistling? 2011-05-04T07:34:25 he was the winner 1 year ago? i dont know i just know about him 2011-05-04T07:34:33 its a nice song really 2011-05-04T07:34:44 im more interested in what u think of hungarian 2011-05-04T07:34:46 the language 2011-05-04T07:35:40 and yes, he is quite sad, and was a very closed person 2011-05-04T07:36:50 was? 2011-05-04T07:37:01 maybe still is 2011-05-04T07:37:04 i have no idea about languages sorry 2011-05-04T07:37:06 who knows 2011-05-04T07:37:15 i am tempted to learn russian 2011-05-04T07:37:19 just because 2011-05-04T07:37:28 is it very weird, or do u think that it sounds fluent? 2011-05-04T07:37:33 and lots of maths was done from soviets that was never translated 2011-05-04T07:37:40 hahah 2011-05-04T07:37:46 very good reason 2011-05-04T07:37:55 maybe lets learn german too 2011-05-04T07:37:56 sounds fluent enough to me 2011-05-04T07:37:59 and chinese 2011-05-04T07:38:56 you know, in the countries which surround hungary, the ppl speak as if someone was pulling their teeth 2011-05-04T07:39:16 bad metaphore 2011-05-04T07:39:38 that damn whistle 2011-05-04T07:39:46 it's worse than those things from the soccer world cup 2011-05-04T07:40:09 what wistle? 2011-05-04T07:40:49 h 2011-05-04T07:41:04 at the end 2011-05-04T07:41:16 the applause, someone is causing the most ridiculous noise ever 2011-05-04T07:41:18 and i mean EVER 2011-05-04T07:41:53 oh that 2011-05-04T07:42:00 i hate that too 2011-05-04T07:43:53 i read the ass-hair article you linked from craigslist 2011-05-04T07:44:11 i have a friend who has this problem exactly 2011-05-04T07:44:20 (no, i dont mean its me) 2011-05-04T07:44:46 he uses some kind of oily-wipes 2011-05-04T07:45:02 instead of standard toilet paper 2011-05-04T07:45:12 it doesn't matter if it's you or your friend 2011-05-04T07:45:15 now i think it's you 2011-05-04T07:45:22 d: 2011-05-04T07:45:35 but they sound like they were afraid of their own hole 2011-05-04T07:45:41 its funny to me 2011-05-04T07:46:50 where do you stand with youre own AI? 2011-05-04T07:46:56 *** orivej has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T07:46:57 for ants? 2011-05-04T07:47:02 sure 2011-05-04T07:47:06 i haven't done anything bar look at food collection 2011-05-04T07:47:09 i've got heaps of uni work atm 2011-05-04T07:47:24 i see 2011-05-04T07:49:42 hehe 2011-05-04T07:50:06 the girl says jack this is something the pople aroud the world will be watching 2011-05-04T07:50:18 but the vid. got 12000 hits 2011-05-04T07:50:22 lol 2011-05-04T07:51:50 to be fair, it only just got put up yesterday, has 5000 for me and i only just put it onto /r/australia a few hours ago after a friend posted it on facebook 2011-05-04T07:54:05 oh sry, didnt the timestamp 2011-05-04T07:54:14 see 2011-05-04T07:54:29 i wish i could see the judges faces right at the start 2011-05-04T08:02:34 oh 2011-05-04T08:02:38 techincal question 2011-05-04T08:02:56 what happens if i try to move my ant outside of the map? 2011-05-04T08:03:02 outside? 2011-05-04T08:03:05 there is no outside 2011-05-04T08:03:10 you're playing on a torus 2011-05-04T08:03:12 yes, there is 2011-05-04T08:03:23 its a matter fo how the engine handles this 2011-05-04T08:03:28 :P 2011-05-04T08:03:32 the edges are wrapped 2011-05-04T08:03:39 the game is on a torus 2011-05-04T08:03:42 do you mean invalid move to width +1? 2011-05-04T08:03:49 i know what it means 2011-05-04T08:03:55 yes 2011-05-04T08:04:03 err no it's impossible 2011-05-04T08:04:06 is it error, or will that get wrapped? 2011-05-04T08:04:10 wrapped 2011-05-04T08:04:11 you give a direction, not coordinates 2011-05-04T08:04:22 oh yes 2011-05-04T08:04:27 or a coordinates of non-existing ant 2011-05-04T08:04:38 you are going to be surrounded on all sides :P 2011-05-04T08:05:21 there is a map generator that needs to be written yet if you're keen 2011-05-04T08:05:25 needs to be done in python though 2011-05-04T08:05:33 huh??? 2011-05-04T08:05:38 i saw a couple of them 2011-05-04T08:05:43 java, python 2011-05-04T08:05:51 why so u need another? 2011-05-04T08:05:53 i expect the current asymmetric python maps to get tossed 2011-05-04T08:05:55 s->d 2011-05-04T08:06:06 the current symmetric python one i made and we'll be using maps at least like that 2011-05-04T08:06:06 and why is that? 2011-05-04T08:06:13 but there is another type of symmetry that can be done 2011-05-04T08:06:25 because they're not "fair" enough and it's impossible to tell how well your bot did 2011-05-04T08:06:56 you mean the current maps are not fair? 2011-05-04T08:07:03 the symmetric ones are 2011-05-04T08:07:08 the asymmetric ones are not perfectly fair 2011-05-04T08:07:10 what else is to fairness then symmetry? 2011-05-04T08:07:16 ok 2011-05-04T08:07:28 although symmetric food spawning isn't on by defailt 2011-05-04T08:07:36 ive got an idea 2011-05-04T08:07:43 u take any non-symmetric map 2011-05-04T08:07:43 you have to add "--food symmetric" to the play_one_game script to do that 2011-05-04T08:07:53 for example with 2-3 players 2011-05-04T08:08:03 and after the game is over 2011-05-04T08:08:06 you rotate them 2011-05-04T08:08:15 and form some score average 2011-05-04T08:08:19 too costly 2011-05-04T08:08:40 there is an idea of using stats of games to judge the "fairness" of a map 2011-05-04T08:08:48 but i don't see us collecting enough data on enough maps 2011-05-04T08:08:57 *** _0x47 <_0x47!~slash@p3EE09E87.dip.t-dialin.net> has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T08:09:10 i think theres too much that can go wrong by "Judging" fairness 2011-05-04T08:09:21 and then correcting scores 2011-05-04T08:09:43 yes 2011-05-04T08:10:03 how about...... 2011-05-04T08:10:04 imo there's already enough necessary problems with ranking bots 2011-05-04T08:10:08 quasi-crystals? 2011-05-04T08:11:00 huh? 2011-05-04T08:11:01 no? 2011-05-04T08:13:12 ? 2011-05-04T08:14:30 e aperiodic forms in nature has produced a paradigm shift in the fields of crystallography. Quasicrystals had been investigated and observed earlier[1] but until the 80s they were disregarded in favor of the prevailing views about the atomic structure of matter. 2011-05-04T08:14:32 Roughly, an ordering is non-periodic if it lacks translational symmetry, which means that a shifted copy will never match exactly with its original. The more precise mathematical definition 2011-05-04T08:14:34 shat 2011-05-04T08:14:36 sry 2011-05-04T08:14:40 i didnt want this :) 2011-05-04T08:14:47 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quasicrystal 2011-05-04T08:14:50 thats it 2011-05-04T08:15:12 non-periodic tiling of the plane 2011-05-04T08:15:34 but its locally symmetric 2011-05-04T08:15:55 u can use as basis-cells some random collection of water-cells 2011-05-04T08:15:58 *** FireFly has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T08:16:32 doesn't really help with symmetry? :P 2011-05-04T08:16:46 i am very fond of the way i made the current symmetric maps 2011-05-04T08:16:55 it took me a day or two to work it out 2011-05-04T08:17:10 my first generator did players in a square lattice 2011-05-04T08:17:11 i saw ur gcd function 2011-05-04T08:17:15 quite nice 2011-05-04T08:17:25 if i updated it, it's thanks to sigh 2011-05-04T08:17:31 if i didn't, it can be done better 2011-05-04T08:18:03 why do we need asymmetric maps at all? 2011-05-04T08:18:11 because j3camero wanted them 2011-05-04T08:18:17 and j3camero gets what he wants :P 2011-05-04T08:18:25 :D 2011-05-04T08:18:50 ok another idea 2011-05-04T08:18:58 take an asymmetric map 2011-05-04T08:18:59 i think the current symmetric maps look fine 2011-05-04T08:19:06 compute the local informational entropy 2011-05-04T08:19:11 doesn't look anywhere near as awful as with the square lattice tilings 2011-05-04T08:19:16 and put the ants where its the same 2011-05-04T08:19:21 have you seen map_analyzer.py? 2011-05-04T08:19:27 no 2011-05-04T08:19:41 that will take a map and partition the locations into sets of which ants can reach them first 2011-05-04T08:19:56 with full equivalence classes for any draws up to any number of ants 2011-05-04T08:20:00 i wrote that too :P 2011-05-04T08:20:17 heh 2011-05-04T08:20:23 i will check it out 2011-05-04T08:20:47 that is one thing we can potentially use to judge the fairness of an asymmetric map 2011-05-04T08:21:12 doing "fair" food spawning on asymmetric maps is a whole other problem too 2011-05-04T08:21:17 we never came up with a nice solution to that 2011-05-04T08:22:50 on the other hand i think you shouldnt be concerned about fairness 2011-05-04T08:23:08 if a bot playes enough rounds, this will be averaged out 2011-05-04T08:24:17 i still laugh at mcleopolds reaction to barontrozo entering the room for the first time in months 2011-05-04T08:24:21 just make sure if a bot started from one position on a particular map, then next time it should start from the next position 2011-05-04T08:24:28 just posts a link to a game of mcleopold winning in planet wars ahahaha 2011-05-04T08:24:47 it's very hard to see how well your bot does for testing then 2011-05-04T08:24:58 and i really don't like it, i personally think symmetric maps are way cooler 2011-05-04T08:25:03 who is baron trozo? 2011-05-04T08:25:13 he did quite well in planet wars 2011-05-04T08:25:28 part of the infamous rufes band 2011-05-04T08:25:46 all contest they remained out of irc, but there was a bunch of them doing well, we were like wtf 2011-05-04T08:25:57 sry im not educated enough to know what ur talking about 2011-05-04T08:26:00 they're a bunch of guys that don't like their workplace, so they go under rufes band 2011-05-04T08:26:24 its like troll? 2011-05-04T08:26:28 no 2011-05-04T08:26:29 i mean its an idiom? 2011-05-04T08:26:39 or a prticular band? 2011-05-04T08:28:12 i see 2011-05-04T08:28:19 just a bunch of workmates 2011-05-04T08:28:27 i see the ranking 2011-05-04T08:28:48 from spain 2011-05-04T08:29:45 why do you think the winner won? 2011-05-04T08:29:53 do you know his strategy? 2011-05-04T08:32:07 he outsmarted everyone 2011-05-04T08:32:13 he was on top for months 2011-05-04T08:32:19 his bot is available in the forums 2011-05-04T08:32:28 i have his bot 2011-05-04T08:32:32 he used a two-ply minimax tree on the first turn and not entirely sure after that 2011-05-04T08:32:52 he once had the worlds best hex bot i am to understand 2011-05-04T08:32:55 how long did the contest last? 2011-05-04T08:32:59 3 months 2011-05-04T08:33:06 hex bot? 2011-05-04T08:33:11 hex is a game 2011-05-04T08:33:17 i dont know it 2011-05-04T08:33:21 not 2? 2011-05-04T08:33:27 no 2011-05-04T08:33:34 tron was like 3 weeksish 2011-05-04T08:33:44 ok, I quit in a middle :) 2011-05-04T08:33:49 i think most people agreed planet wars was a little too long 2011-05-04T08:33:57 so my suggestion has been to go at 2 months in the middle 2011-05-04T08:34:00 one season 2011-05-04T08:34:04 sure it is long 2011-05-04T08:34:23 we don't want people to be rushed on time though 2011-05-04T08:34:32 it's a contest about who can come up with the best strategy 2011-05-04T08:34:53 i should really quit tinkering now 2011-05-04T08:40:02 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T08:48:45 *** computerwiz_2222 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2011-05-04T08:58:23 the origin is the upper left corner right? 2011-05-04T09:00:27 yes 2011-05-04T09:00:32 like writing on a file 2011-05-04T09:00:37 or indexing a matrix 2011-05-04T09:00:42 the way any sane person would do it :) 2011-05-04T09:02:14 huh, ok, im sane then :) 2011-05-04T09:12:45 *** kaemo has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T09:26:57 god bless the LOOP macro 2011-05-04T09:36:31 *** berak has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T09:51:42 lol stupid me 2011-05-04T09:51:49 i tried to call nil: (nil) 2011-05-04T09:52:28 cannot have? 2011-05-04T09:52:34 *** orivej has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T09:53:05 u mean if its forbidden? 2011-05-04T09:53:07 yes it is 2011-05-04T09:53:16 (function args) 2011-05-04T09:53:23 is the syntaxis for anything in lisp 2011-05-04T09:53:38 and i finished and if case with nil, the false value 2011-05-04T09:53:45 but i out it in paranthesis 2011-05-04T09:53:49 o->p 2011-05-04T10:05:01 *** sigh has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-05-04T10:24:14 *** janzert has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-05-04T10:24:16 *** Ttech has quit IRC (Quit: Your nick was overruled.) 2011-05-04T10:25:54 *** janzert has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T10:29:39 *** orivej has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-05-04T10:43:17 *** Ttech has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T11:02:10 *** aerique has quit IRC (Quit: ...) 2011-05-04T11:21:39 *** valtex has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-05-04T11:27:21 *** amriedle has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T11:36:33 *** woudshoo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T11:38:51 *** boegel has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T11:42:17 aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon-io * rcaee103 / (14 files in 7 dirs): updating io for engine.py and playgame.py (in progress) - http://bit.ly/iulDgF 2011-05-04T11:51:29 *** McLeopold has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T11:54:14 *** _0x47 <_0x47!~slash@p3EE09E87.dip.t-dialin.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-05-04T11:54:30 *** _0x47 <_0x47!~slash@p3EE09E87.dip.t-dialin.net> has joined #aichallenge 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timeout: 248 seconds) 2011-05-04T16:55:05 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T16:59:33 *** Mathnerd314 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T17:02:03 *** Naktibalda has quit IRC (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 4.0.1/20110422205559]) 2011-05-04T17:24:49 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2011-05-04T17:27:12 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T17:35:21 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T17:36:02 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T17:41:29 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T17:42:25 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T17:45:51 *** mcstar has left #aichallenge ("WeeChat 0.3.4") 2011-05-04T17:58:40 *** _0x47 <_0x47!~slash@p3EE09E87.dip.t-dialin.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2011-05-04T18:01:05 *** FireFly has quit IRC (Quit: swatted to death) 2011-05-04T18:01:13 *** ltriant has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T18:08:58 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T18:09:28 *** Mathnerd314 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2011-05-04T18:09:35 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T18:14:08 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T18:20:04 *** Mathnerd314_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T18:20:35 *** Mathnerd314_ is now known as Mathnerd314 2011-05-04T18:44:16 *** Kingpin13 has quit IRC (Quit: money can't buy you love, but it can if you have enough) 2011-05-04T18:48:59 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T19:00:24 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2011-05-04T19:01:02 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T19:18:03 It's really dead in here... 2011-05-04T19:29:46 yeaaah 2011-05-04T19:30:10 im customizing my rc.lua 2011-05-04T19:30:24 *** mceier has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) 2011-05-04T19:31:25 since you ppl are usually programmers 2011-05-04T19:31:31 *** Apophis has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-05-04T19:31:40 i would recommend that you try a tiling window manager 2011-05-04T19:31:49 if you havent already 2011-05-04T19:32:11 *** Apophis has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T19:37:38 *** computerwiz_2222 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T19:46:36 mcstar: which one? 2011-05-04T19:46:51 im using awesome for some time 2011-05-04T19:47:14 i was worried about the lua config solution 2011-05-04T19:47:20 but its managable 2011-05-04T19:47:33 you may have heard of it, did you? 2011-05-04T19:48:30 nope 2011-05-04T19:49:52 its a little scripting language which is embeddable, and awesome has this as its configuration interface 2011-05-04T19:50:13 oh, I've heard of lua, just not awesome 2011-05-04T19:50:23 k 2011-05-04T19:50:44 well, its as good as any of the other tiling wms 2011-05-04T19:50:56 some might say its even better 2011-05-04T19:51:00 i have no problem using it 2011-05-04T19:51:15 just make sure you read the basic shortcuts before u try it 2011-05-04T19:51:47 but when i will understand haskell, i will switch to xmonad probably 2011-05-04T19:52:02 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T19:53:02 everything is SUPER fast under these suckers 2011-05-04T19:53:06 I just bought learn you a haskell :) 2011-05-04T19:53:22 how many pages? 2011-05-04T19:53:27 ? 2011-05-04T19:53:32 about 300 2011-05-04T19:53:44 i only saw the online version 2011-05-04T19:53:47 thats why im asking 2011-05-04T19:54:15 Is the printed version dramatically different from the web version (aside from being on dead trees)? 2011-05-04T19:54:32 no, I just killed a tree for no reason 2011-05-04T19:54:34 is it more newbie oriented then real world haskell? 2011-05-04T19:54:52 It's a little more gentle, though with less emphasis on applications. 2011-05-04T19:55:04 (assuming it's the same as web) 2011-05-04T19:55:04 It's more "play with math" oriented than "program projects" oriented 2011-05-04T19:55:29 should be exactly the same 2011-05-04T19:55:30 fibs = 0:1: zipWith (+) fibs (tail fibs) 2011-05-04T19:55:41 this is my favorite program in haskell for the time being 2011-05-04T19:55:46 (actually its data) 2011-05-04T19:56:28 that's close to obfuscated c 2011-05-04T19:56:37 really? 2011-05-04T19:56:42 this is clear haskell 2011-05-04T19:56:59 it's not immediatly obvious what it is doing 2011-05-04T19:57:11 but the syntax is clear 2011-05-04T19:57:13 to me, who doesn't know haskell yes 2011-05-04T19:57:13 i think 2011-05-04T19:57:26 it is consice 2011-05-04T19:57:28 i dont know either 2011-05-04T19:57:36 i found this as an exmaple for corecursion 2011-05-04T19:57:54 i looked at it for a minute before i understood 2011-05-04T19:57:58 That's fairly clever. It has the oddity that it returns 0 as part of the Fibonacci sequence. 2011-05-04T19:58:09 it is part of it 2011-05-04T19:58:16 0 1 1 2 3 5.... 2011-05-04T19:58:29 and it doesnt returns 2011-05-04T19:58:33 i hope its clear 2011-05-04T19:58:38 its a sequence 2011-05-04T19:58:40 or array 2011-05-04T19:58:44 you have to : 2011-05-04T19:58:49 Yes, but it's an array beginning with zero. 2011-05-04T19:58:50 take 22 fibs 2011-05-04T19:59:06 yep 2011-05-04T19:59:07 Which is not usually considered part of the Fibonacci sequence (easily fixed, though). 2011-05-04T19:59:23 well as far as i know it is:) 2011-05-04T19:59:30 Ah, never mind. 2011-05-04T19:59:32 I'm an idiot. 2011-05-04T19:59:36 I remembered it as 1,1,2… 2011-05-04T19:59:49 thats correct tooo 2011-05-04T19:59:51 In any case, it's fairly clever. 2011-05-04T19:59:56 but it works from 0 too 2011-05-04T20:00:19 Yeah, I know. I just wasn't used to seeing it presented as beginning with zero. 2011-05-04T20:00:24 http://oeis.org/A000045 2011-05-04T20:00:27 well, obviously i dont think that when someone writes haskell every line is THAT clever :) 2011-05-04T20:01:59 oh the integers sequences database 2011-05-04T20:02:28 so 2011-05-04T20:02:36 what is youre current wm? 2011-05-04T20:02:59 aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon-io * r7076cde / (10 files in 5 dirs): worker now gets proper python dict back, added bad bots - http://bit.ly/jxmwsK 2011-05-04T20:03:07 -e 2011-05-04T20:03:19 Windows 7 :p 2011-05-04T20:03:27 ah ok 2011-05-04T20:03:47 nat bad though 2011-05-04T20:03:51 i was pleased with it 2011-05-04T20:03:56 I've got [Windows] + [Left/Right], and it's good enough right now. 2011-05-04T20:04:03 actually never had problems with windows 2011-05-04T20:04:24 i had to fix other ppls windows always 2011-05-04T20:04:29 *** Mathnerd314 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-05-04T20:04:49 Oh, Windows (even 7) is quite capable of having its problems (though less bad than before). 2011-05-04T20:05:00 I had a troupe of blue-screening W7 VMs at one point. 2011-05-04T20:05:14 i tried it in virtualbox 2011-05-04T20:05:23 adn last summer 2011-05-04T20:05:31 i played half life 2 and portal on it 2011-05-04T20:05:35 *** McLeopold has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2011-05-04T20:05:38 but thats all 2011-05-04T20:06:13 i first encountered linux in 2004 2011-05-04T20:06:39 since ~ 2006 im using it exclusively 2011-05-04T20:07:03 *** bhasker has quit IRC (Quit: bhasker) 2011-05-04T20:07:37 in linux? 2011-05-04T20:08:07 What's your question? 2011-05-04T20:08:16 blue-screening W7 VMs 2011-05-04T20:08:23 did they run on linux? 2011-05-04T20:08:33 Ah, three blue-screening Windows 7 VMs on a Windows XP host in Microsoft Virtual PC. 2011-05-04T20:08:37 Microsoft all the way down. 2011-05-04T20:08:53 why would you need that? 2011-05-04T20:09:01 just to try it out? 2011-05-04T20:09:03 Work. Desktop deployment stuff. 2011-05-04T20:09:18 MDT+SCCM magic self-installing Windows. 2011-05-04T20:09:35 so ur basically a windows person 2011-05-04T20:09:47 Not personally, no. But my employer at the time is. 2011-05-04T20:09:53 I use a Mac desktop and Linux servers. 2011-05-04T20:10:07 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T20:10:07 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2011-05-04T20:10:11 i used a powerbook g4 for 1.5 years 2011-05-04T20:10:18 with leo 2011-05-04T20:10:32 the gui is nice 2011-05-04T20:10:39 but it was a bit slow 2011-05-04T20:10:47 and had the same problems as windows 2011-05-04T20:10:56 which is why i dont like them 2011-05-04T20:11:04 Which problems are you referring to, if I may ask? 2011-05-04T20:11:25 well, customization for one 2011-05-04T20:11:36 to be productiv u have to download a lot of stuff 2011-05-04T20:11:46 90% of them are usually cracked 2011-05-04T20:11:53 It's true that OS X (at least the surface layer) is less customizable. 2011-05-04T20:12:02 yes 2011-05-04T20:12:09 But you can install your own Unix utilities and Python installation and such. 2011-05-04T20:12:15 i even managed to change the background of the dock 2011-05-04T20:12:36 Yeah, you have to be content with certain aspects of the GUI (I am). 2011-05-04T20:12:53 then i have to install quicksolver 2011-05-04T20:12:57 silver 2011-05-04T20:13:02 and other utilities 2011-05-04T20:13:16 but all this goodness in linux is a command away 2011-05-04T20:13:18 And you're satisfied with the default installation of {insert distro here}? 2011-05-04T20:13:30 Ah, OK. 2011-05-04T20:13:39 Yes, package managers have their pros. 2011-05-04T20:13:39 i use arch 2011-05-04T20:13:50 by default u have a nice back real termnal 2011-05-04T20:14:07 "nice back real termnal"? 2011-05-04T20:14:30 as in no graphical backend, no x windows 2011-05-04T20:14:51 just a couple of core packages to get yopu started 2011-05-04T20:15:06 and then u install exactly what you want 2011-05-04T20:15:10 It's true. It does mean that much more work to get "productive", as you say, though certainly a package manager helps with that. 2011-05-04T20:15:28 but then i can save this productivity 2011-05-04T20:15:32 all the configs 2011-05-04T20:15:39 i can even dd the whole partition 2011-05-04T20:15:45 Config files are movable on other platforms, too. :P 2011-05-04T20:15:54 dd on another machine and use my system 2011-05-04T20:15:59 ok 2011-05-04T20:16:06 try to find all the windows configs 2011-05-04T20:16:08 or macs 2011-05-04T20:16:14 ~/Library on Mac. 2011-05-04T20:16:20 and theres anotehr one 2011-05-04T20:16:20 Mostly ~/Library/Preferences. 2011-05-04T20:16:23 yes 2011-05-04T20:16:40 I've never had to move a config file that wasn't in ~/Library (except MacVim which uses ~/.vimrc and such). 2011-05-04T20:16:53 oh and ports 2011-05-04T20:17:06 MacPorts is a pain, if that's what you're referring to. 2011-05-04T20:17:09 i dont want to comopile from source all the time 2011-05-04T20:17:14 yep 2011-05-04T20:17:41 That's not even an Apple technology. I use Homebrew (which also compiles), but frankly I don't install/uninstall software all that often. 2011-05-04T20:17:42 maybe i had a bad experience because the powerbook was a little slow 2011-05-04T20:18:05 apple techology? 2011-05-04T20:18:11 Apple didn't invent MacPorts. 2011-05-04T20:18:13 It's a third-party thing. 2011-05-04T20:18:13 i dont care where it comes from 2011-05-04T20:18:19 *** Mathnerd314 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T20:18:36 but if i want access to opensource gnu tools i have to use it 2011-05-04T20:18:40 I'm more or less saying that you aren't forced to use MacPorts. 2011-05-04T20:18:57 Personally, I'm happy with the build quality of the Macs, and there are aspects of the GUI and Mac applications that I find simply more refined than on Linux (et al). Though I would be using Linux if I didn't have my Mac (and indeed I do for servers and such). 2011-05-04T20:19:07 Really, I'm not trying to convert you or anything – don't worry. 2011-05-04T20:19:19 i already tried it 2011-05-04T20:19:56 even on linux im moving towrds minimalistic tiling wms 2011-05-04T20:20:16 so finally im not obsessed with the gui 2011-05-04T20:20:19 the beauty 2011-05-04T20:20:31 yes, linux was always uglier 2011-05-04T20:20:56 by the time it actually got pretty, i wont see its beaty 2011-05-04T20:20:58 :) 2011-05-04T20:21:38 what i liked in osx were the keyboard shortcuts 2011-05-04T20:22:03 but it seems win7 features some more too 2011-05-04T20:22:15 Haha, the problem isn't effort (look at Compiz), it's the lack of creative direction (really an intrinsic problem with open-source: it's built by engineers, not designers). But that's fine – Linux isn't supposed to be OS X or Windows in my mind. 2011-05-04T20:22:20 They're all capable OSes in their own right. 2011-05-04T20:22:37 yeah 2011-05-04T20:22:56 the problem with windows is that there a malice in the world and stupid users 2011-05-04T20:23:13 Microsoft has another problem and that is legacy support. 2011-05-04T20:23:26 Windows could use a more drastic makeover but they can't break legacy compatibility. 2011-05-04T20:23:29 but its getting virtualized 2011-05-04T20:23:34 so its not a problem anymore 2011-05-04T20:23:35 It's only with Windows 7 x64 that 16-bit support was dropped. 2011-05-04T20:23:40 It's still a problem. 2011-05-04T20:23:50 VMs can help with it, but they don't completely solve it. 2011-05-04T20:24:06 i think win7 has a win xp virtual runtime 2011-05-04T20:24:16 Yes, there is support for this in some editions. 2011-05-04T20:24:25 But it doesn't let Microsoft get away with rewriting the OS. 2011-05-04T20:24:43 It just gives them a Band-Aid solution to those cases that are really tough to support. 2011-05-04T20:25:32 Windows Vista was much-maligned, but what it was was Microsoft's attempt to make some much-needed changes in the least-damaging way possible. Windows 7 was them actually fixing all of the problems those changes created, but a lot of good stuff came in Vista. 2011-05-04T20:25:34 well, my biased opinion is that everyone on the techincal side and not bound to some stupid windows only software should use linux 2011-05-04T20:26:15 or at least give it a try 2011-05-04T20:26:31 I know that a lot of people feel that way, but there are plenty of bright technical Windows and Mac users who use that software not because they can't figure out bash but because they prefer it. The "give it a try" point is fairer, I think. 2011-05-04T20:26:34 its a bit like for example for me learning haskell 2011-05-04T20:27:13 in principle its like any other programming language 2011-05-04T20:27:37 but i think i will have to put more effort in it to get to the level to use it efficiently 2011-05-04T20:27:52 but then i expect more return than from an another language 2011-05-04T20:28:08 Part of it is that it's simply more of a departure from past programming experience for most people. 2011-05-04T20:28:18 Haskell is really nice, though. 2011-05-04T20:28:27 yes 2011-05-04T20:28:33 a:) 2011-05-04T20:28:53 but i just got to know common lisp 2011-05-04T20:29:09 i finished my random bot today 2011-05-04T20:29:43 so i will let some time passs before i will pick up a haskell book 2011-05-04T20:31:19 340 lines 2011-05-04T20:31:29 but its extensible of course 2011-05-04T20:32:10 im thinking on reading up on swarm behavior and some genetic algorithms 2011-05-04T20:33:22 btw have you searched for existing solutions for the ant problem 2011-05-04T20:33:33 before you started to plan this contest? 2011-05-04T20:33:59 people must have had work on this before 2011-05-04T20:34:11 or at least very similar problems 2011-05-04T20:35:24 *** kaemo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2011-05-04T20:39:52 *** needsch has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2011-05-04T20:54:54 *** mcstar has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4) 2011-05-04T21:29:21 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T21:29:45 *** delt0r___ has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2011-05-04T21:32:11 *** AlliedEnvy has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2011-05-04T21:35:02 *** AlliedEnvy has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T21:50:18 *** jmpespxoreax has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2011-05-04T21:50:36 *** jmpespxoreax has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T21:53:30 *** jmpespxoreax has quit IRC (Changing host) 2011-05-04T21:53:30 *** jmpespxoreax has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T21:57:50 *** rap3point0 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T22:27:10 *** rap3point0 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T22:27:13 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2011-05-04T22:27:52 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T22:29:19 *** computerwiz_2222 is now known as computerwiz_222 2011-05-04T22:38:21 *** Cyndre has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2011-05-04T22:40:10 *** rap3point0 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T22:46:13 *** Cyndre has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T22:56:58 *** rap3point0 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 2011-05-04T22:57:08 *** JaycobColeman has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:03:25 *** rap3point0 has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:17:46 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 2011-05-04T23:19:17 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:31:21 *** Blargs has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:35:57 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T23:37:06 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:39:57 *** Mathnerd314 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2011-05-04T23:46:38 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-05-04T23:47:23 *** Meatkat has joined #aichallenge 2011-05-04T23:58:25 *** Meatkat has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)