2011-05-21T00:00:22  <demerzel> oh duh i figured it out
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2011-05-21T00:09:11  <antimatroid> i'm stuck on ready to be compiled?
2011-05-21T00:09:22  <amstan> oshit, forgot to turn on the worker
2011-05-21T00:09:36  <amstan> there
2011-05-21T00:09:50  <amstan> antimatroid: done compiling
2011-05-21T00:11:50  <demerzel> bleh i really don't care enough to debug th cs bot
2011-05-21T00:12:13  <demerzel> would help if i knew for sure it needed to be debugged lol
2011-05-21T00:12:34  <amstan> demerzel: did you get the local testing going?
2011-05-21T00:12:43  <demerzel> painfully
2011-05-21T00:12:49  <demerzel> it's not helping me much since i can barely get it to work
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2011-05-21T00:12:59  <amstan> ?
2011-05-21T00:13:00  <demerzel> much less use it to pinpoint problems in the bots
2011-05-21T00:13:11  <antimatroid> my bot fails when i have it collecting food on whatever the tests are
2011-05-21T00:13:30  <amstan> k, fine
2011-05-21T00:13:31  <demerzel> where did you see that
2011-05-21T00:13:36  * amstan looks at what the test thing actually does
2011-05-21T00:15:38  <amstan> so.. it runs a game against this bot: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/blob/epsilon/ants/submission_test/TestBot.py
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2011-05-21T00:15:55  <amstan> https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/blob/epsilon/worker/worker.py#L358
2011-05-21T00:16:06  <amstan> as long as your bot does not "if result['status'][0] in ('crashed', 'timeout', 'invalid'):"
2011-05-21T00:16:09  <amstan> you pass
2011-05-21T00:16:43  <demerzel> hmm
2011-05-21T00:17:00  <amstan> antimatroid:  i could try pause the worker, and see what problem you have
2011-05-21T00:17:03  <demerzel> also i pulled replay data for 2938 and it has matchupid:2950 in the json dat
2011-05-21T00:17:10  <demerzel> is that right
2011-05-21T00:17:23  <amstan> demerzel: matchupid is not the same as gameid
2011-05-21T00:17:31  <demerzel> ok juts checking
2011-05-21T00:18:03  <antimatroid> i tried playing with that testbot.py locally and it crashed
2011-05-21T00:18:18  <amstan> antimatroid: who did? your bot?
2011-05-21T00:18:42  <antimatroid> no, TestBot.py crashed
2011-05-21T00:18:47  <amstan> hmm
2011-05-21T00:18:48  <amstan> interesting
2011-05-21T00:19:50  <demerzel> haha
2011-05-21T00:19:53  <demerzel> vindicatino
2011-05-21T00:20:16  <amstan> antimatroid: testbot works fine for me
2011-05-21T00:20:16  <antimatroid> http://pastebin.com/MjfNULrY
2011-05-21T00:20:42  <amstan> antimatroid: do you have latest version?
2011-05-21T00:20:49  <antimatroid> not where i ran that
2011-05-21T00:20:53  <antimatroid> :P
2011-05-21T00:21:04  <antimatroid> it takes me some effort to copy new stuff over to where i test
2011-05-21T00:21:08  <amstan> so, why do you expect it to work?
2011-05-21T00:21:17  <amstan> copy? you just do git pull
2011-05-21T00:21:28  <antimatroid> no, i have a local copy of everything i can mess around with
2011-05-21T00:21:36  <antimatroid> without having git bitch at me for my local copy being different
2011-05-21T00:21:42  <amstan> ...
2011-05-21T00:21:44  <amstan> you're doing it wrong
2011-05-21T00:22:04  <antimatroid> :p
2011-05-21T00:22:21  <demerzel> this is all natural only if you are a linux python person
2011-05-21T00:22:33  <demerzel> .cmd to run python is so against my normal usage pattern
2011-05-21T00:22:51  <amstan> demerzel: that .cmd file was made by a windows user as well
2011-05-21T00:23:18  <antimatroid> it runs now
2011-05-21T00:23:35  <demerzel> amstan: they only work if .py files are associated with python and the paths are set
2011-05-21T00:23:41  <demerzel> which in my case neither was true
2011-05-21T00:23:56  <demerzel> plus who uses .cmd for batch files sheesh
2011-05-21T00:24:07  <demerzel> linux users is the answer
2011-05-21T00:24:31  <amstan> normal programs should have paths set
2011-05-21T00:24:41  <demerzel> you know what play_one_game.cmd did
2011-05-21T00:24:48  <amstan> the fact that 99% of windows programs don't do it... that's just sad
2011-05-21T00:24:52  <demerzel> opened playgame.py in notepad++ lol
2011-05-21T00:25:09  <amstan> when i installed python in my windows system, i had to do it
2011-05-21T00:25:19  <demerzel> they don't need to they rely on other variables
2011-05-21T00:25:28  <demerzel> %USERENV% %WINDOWS% etc
2011-05-21T00:25:33  <amstan> and i had to navigate through like 10 menu systems until i got to do it
2011-05-21T00:26:49  <amstan> woah! this is major: http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/e19caWJdUtg/Confirmed-Microsoft-Says-It-Will-Open-Source-VB-6
2011-05-21T00:26:53  <antimatroid> ergh, no it didn't, i'm confused
2011-05-21T00:27:20  <demerzel> amstan: bottom line nobody runs command line anything any more in windows
2011-05-21T00:27:33  <demerzel> not even developers most of the time
2011-05-21T00:27:48  <amstan> demerzel: yes, that's why you need an IDE most of the time in windows
2011-05-21T00:28:00  <demerzel> yes they are quite handy
2011-05-21T00:28:01  <amstan> or else it's suicide to dev on it
2011-05-21T00:28:10  <demerzel> are you anti-ide lol]
2011-05-21T00:28:44  <demerzel> at some point you just gotta say 'well i /could/ control every aspect of my computer but that's a huge waste of time for minimal gain'
2011-05-21T00:28:49  <amstan> i didn't say that, i said that windows makes it impossible to code without an ide
2011-05-21T00:28:56  <demerzel> nah its not impossible
2011-05-21T00:29:01  <amstan> painful*
2011-05-21T00:29:05  <demerzel> i coded C last year in notepad++
2011-05-21T00:29:24  <amstan> demerzel: and how did you compile?
2011-05-21T00:29:27  <demerzel> gcc
2011-05-21T00:29:33  <demerzel> just a batch file
2011-05-21T00:29:38  <amstan> didn't you need to set paths for that?
2011-05-21T00:29:39  <demerzel> doubleclicked it
2011-05-21T00:29:40  <demerzel> OHNO
2011-05-21T00:29:42  <demerzel> haha
2011-05-21T00:29:48  <demerzel> no just used absolute
2011-05-21T00:29:49  <amstan> so you had the gcc location hardcoded?
2011-05-21T00:29:59  <amstan> now.. what if you need to give your program to another person?
2011-05-21T00:30:06  <amstan> do they have to install gcc in the same location as you?
2011-05-21T00:30:10  <demerzel> no
2011-05-21T00:30:13  <amstan> what if they have a different letter for the drive?
2011-05-21T00:30:14  <demerzel> if they wanted to use the batch file yes
2011-05-21T00:30:23  <demerzel> but hopefully if they are getting my code they know how to compile
2011-05-21T00:30:43  <amstan> yes, this breaks down if you have more than 3 source files
2011-05-21T00:30:52  <amstan> your bash script gets more complex
2011-05-21T00:31:02  <amstan> and nobody will have to go through it to replace all your hardcoded paths
2011-05-21T00:31:03  <demerzel> yea well its more useful in windows to do it that way
2011-05-21T00:31:06  <demerzel> as opposed to trying to command line it
2011-05-21T00:31:18  <amstan> bash files are command line..
2011-05-21T00:31:30  <demerzel> bash files are essentially the same thing as batch files
2011-05-21T00:31:37  <demerzel> .cmd or whatever
2011-05-21T00:31:39  <amstan> batch*
2011-05-21T00:31:45  <demerzel> batch = windows
2011-05-21T00:31:50  <demerzel> oh oh
2011-05-21T00:31:51  <amstan> batch files are command line..
2011-05-21T00:31:52  <antimatroid> i get the same error with the current copy of everything
2011-05-21T00:32:01  <demerzel> yea but the point is you can double click a batch file
2011-05-21T00:32:02  <amstan> antimatroid: the testbot works for me just fine
2011-05-21T00:32:11  <demerzel> rather than typing it out
2011-05-21T00:32:14  <amstan> demerzel: you can double click a .sh file, what's your point?
2011-05-21T00:32:23  <antimatroid> i can run the games with hunter and lefty
2011-05-21T00:32:25  <demerzel> i dont even remember what we're talking about any more i am going t back to decoding replays
2011-05-21T00:32:30  <antimatroid> but when i add testbot, it crashses :\
2011-05-21T00:32:53  <amstan> antimatroid: and by it you mean ...
2011-05-21T00:33:01  <antimatroid> TestBot.py
2011-05-21T00:33:05  <antimatroid> i'm not even running my bot in the game
2011-05-21T00:33:13  <amstan> antimatroid: can you send me your command?
2011-05-21T00:33:40  <antimatroid> http://pastebin.com/Z9pBErhE
2011-05-21T00:34:14  <amstan> supposed to be submission_test/TestBot.py
2011-05-21T00:34:30  <antimatroid> i just copied the file you linked to, hang on
2011-05-21T00:34:41  <amstan> antimatroid: i linked the one from submission_test
2011-05-21T00:34:55  <amstan> ./playgame.py --seed 42 --end_wait=0.25 --verbose --log_dir game_logs --turns 100 --map_file maps/symmetric_maps/symmetric_10.map "$@" "python submission_test/TestBot.py" "python dist/sample_bots/python/LeftyBot.py" "python dist/sample_bots/python/HunterBot.py" "python dist/sample_bots/python/LeftyBot.py"
2011-05-21T00:35:17  <antimatroid> okay, that runs
2011-05-21T00:35:50  <amstan> antimatroid: there is no dist/sample_bots/python/TestBot.py
2011-05-21T00:35:50  <demerzel> wait food is generated dynamically
2011-05-21T00:35:54  <amstan> demerzel: yes
2011-05-21T00:35:58  <demerzel> and has a dynamic shelf-life
2011-05-21T00:35:59  <antimatroid> there is when i make it
2011-05-21T00:36:01  <demerzel> man this is gonna be rough
2011-05-21T00:36:03  <amstan> demerzel: part of it is made from start too
2011-05-21T00:37:48  <antimatroid> my bot plays fine against it locally :\
2011-05-21T00:38:44  <amstan> antimatroid: ugh.. can you send me your bot?
2011-05-21T00:38:56  <amstan> antimatroid: make sure it includes a makefile or something
2011-05-21T00:38:59  <amstan> so i can easily compile it
2011-05-21T00:40:53  <antimatroid> what email do you want it to? :P
2011-05-21T00:41:00  <amstan> amstan@ai-contest is good
2011-05-21T00:41:02  <antimatroid> this is my food collection algo, i'm not just uploading the code
2011-05-21T00:41:10  <amstan> i'll keep it safe
2011-05-21T00:41:13  <amstan> don't worry
2011-05-21T00:43:08  <demerzel> send it to me
2011-05-21T00:43:13  <demerzel> oh you already did ty
2011-05-21T00:43:20  <antimatroid> sent
2011-05-21T00:43:24  <demerzel> lol
2011-05-21T00:43:25  <amstan> demerzel: you wish
2011-05-21T00:43:27  <demerzel> like i can read haskell
2011-05-21T00:43:33  <antimatroid> it's c++
2011-05-21T00:43:38  <demerzel> oh ok yea then send it
2011-05-21T00:43:39  <amstan> demerzel: fail
2011-05-21T00:44:51  <antimatroid> bbiab, gotta finish cooking lunch
2011-05-21T00:45:19  <amstan> antimatroid: is it supposed to go for food, then stop moving?
2011-05-21T00:45:21  <amstan> it does that
2011-05-21T00:45:29  <amstan> against testbot too
2011-05-21T00:45:33  <amstan> me is confused...
2011-05-21T00:45:42  <demerzel> ugh you gave away the secrets
2011-05-21T00:46:33  * amstan advises for everyone to wait until https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/issues/114 is fixed
2011-05-21T00:46:49  * amstan has a feeling that the test games and the actual games are mixed up
2011-05-21T00:46:51  <antimatroid> amstan: yeah
2011-05-21T00:47:09  <demerzel> is dhartmei gonna host again this year
2011-05-21T00:47:09  <amstan> antimatroid: oh yeah, what happens to your bot with no food
2011-05-21T00:47:16  * amstan is testing
2011-05-21T00:47:21  <antimatroid> it should just do nothing
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2011-05-21T00:47:51  <demerzel> energy conservation, brilliant
2011-05-21T00:47:58  <demerzel> like a coiled snake
2011-05-21T00:48:01  <amstan> status survived survived survived survived
2011-05-21T00:48:03  <amstan> all good
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2011-05-21T00:51:04  <amstan> antimatroid: oh.. got something interesting
2011-05-21T00:52:00  <amstan> antimatroid: your bot timed out on this
2011-05-21T00:52:14  <amstan> ./playgame.py --seed 42 --food none --end_wait=0.25 --verbose --log_dir game_logs --turns 30 --debug --map_file submission_test/test.map "$yourbot" "python submission_test/TestBot.py"
2011-05-21T00:52:20  <amstan> doesn't work, it times out
2011-05-21T00:54:54  <amstan> try seeing if it works with 2 players
2011-05-21T00:54:57  <amstan> instead of 4
2011-05-21T01:01:14  <antimatroid> hmmm okay, shouldn't make a difference but i'll have a play later
2011-05-21T01:01:19  <antimatroid> eating atm then i need to go out for a little while
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2011-05-21T04:42:57  <smiley1983> When installing Ubuntu server as a base for setting up the contest code, should I allow tasksel to install LAMP server software, or will server_setup do this?
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2011-05-21T08:06:56  <janzert> contestbot: later tell amstan no, compilation has not been sandboxed yet.
2011-05-21T08:06:56  <contestbot> janzert: Aye, aye, sir
2011-05-21T08:09:32  <janzert> contestbot: later tell amstan also I'm working out of town until Thursday so so probably won't be coding anything until after that
2011-05-21T08:09:32  <contestbot> janzert: As you wish.
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2011-05-21T08:11:18  <mcstar> contestbot: self-destruct!
2011-05-21T08:11:19  <contestbot> mcstar: User error, it's not my fault.
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2011-05-21T08:24:15  <smiley1983> I've set up a VM with Ubuntu and the contest code, completed the install instructions - I can access the website, create users, upload code and so on. Can anyone tell me how to set the contest code running so it plays matches, updates rankings and so on?
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2011-05-21T09:21:06  <Nebri> *yawns and waves*
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2011-05-21T09:24:36  <smiley1983> I'm running setup_worker.py on my virtual machine, hoping it will make it run the contest code, but I'm beginning to think I've made a mistake, that this is actually for doing the entire OS install and other setup... somewhere
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2011-05-21T10:55:55  <McLeopold> antimatroid: how goes it?
2011-05-21T10:57:13  <smiley1983> McLeopold: when setting up the contest code inside a virtual machine for testing, do you know if I should run worker_setup.py?
2011-05-21T10:58:18  <smiley1983> To clarify: when I say "for testing", I mean including use of website, trueskill and so on, not just for running local matches.
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2011-05-21T11:07:34  <McLeopold> smiley1983: you need both server_setup and worker_setup.  I would suggest without the jails.
2011-05-21T11:08:29  <smiley1983> If I've already set it running with jails, I would probably need to redo most of it in order to run without, am I right?
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2011-05-21T11:19:50  <McLeopold> smiley1983: no, just turn them off
2011-05-21T11:20:03  <McLeopold> you can run everything without running any of the setup stuff
2011-05-21T11:20:20  <McLeopold> you just need to setup the server_info.py files yourself and create directories
2011-05-21T11:20:54  <smiley1983> dmd just failed compiling... what directories do I need to create? Is it documented somewhere?
2011-05-21T11:21:09  <McLeopold> put this key in worker/server_info.py, "secure_jails": False
2011-05-21T11:21:21  <McLeopold> dmd is hard, as janzert about htat
2011-05-21T11:22:07  <smiley1983> I don't need it myself if I can get everything running without completing worker_setup
2011-05-21T11:22:39  <McLeopold> what language are you going to write in?
2011-05-21T11:22:43  <smiley1983> Once secure_jail is set, is there some command I should run to set the contest code running?
2011-05-21T11:22:46  <smiley1983> OCaml
2011-05-21T11:23:04  <smiley1983> probably, unless I decide to learn haskell in time :)
2011-05-21T11:23:07  <McLeopold> OCaml is working good on the test server
2011-05-21T11:23:35  <smiley1983> Yes, I was happy to see the starter pack compiling and playing games :)
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2011-05-21T11:52:15  <smiley1983> I've seen mention of a start_worker.sh script, but it doesn't seem to exist in any of my clones - is it generated during worker_setup.py?
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2011-05-21T12:05:25  <smiley1983> I've now persuaded worker_setup.py to get up to the point where it complains about the lack of start_worker.sh - if anyone knows what the script is meant to do, or why it isn't there (in my clone or on github) I'd like to know :)
2011-05-21T12:07:44  <smiley1983> for context, if it's relevant: running python worker.py -t -n 0 gives endless "Get task error: [Errno http error] no host given"
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2011-05-21T12:17:57  <McLeopold> smiley1983: you need an http server runing for worker to pull tasks
2011-05-21T12:21:30  <smiley1983> I have apache2 installed - is there any special setup, and is it automated somewhere?
2011-05-21T12:22:51  <McLeopold> it is
2011-05-21T12:23:07  <McLeopold> look at apache.template
2011-05-21T12:25:34  <smiley1983> Hm. I just restarted, and now my virtual machine won't boot. I'm going to have to do some more setup before I can proceed. Thankyou for your help, and sorry to have drawn you away from your other tasks.
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2011-05-21T12:41:14  <McLeopold> amstan: what happened to our test server?
2011-05-21T12:41:20  <amstan> McLeopold: it's off, hold on
2011-05-21T12:41:48  <demerzel> where is the ants i need the ants
2011-05-21T12:42:02  <amstan> McLeopold: have you seen my recent bug reports?
2011-05-21T12:42:05  <McLeopold> in your pants
2011-05-21T12:42:09  <demerzel> ty
2011-05-21T12:42:11  <amstan> lol
2011-05-21T12:42:12  <McLeopold> no, on github?
2011-05-21T12:42:14  <amstan> yes
2011-05-21T12:42:26  <amstan> most of the games are with 30 turns and no food
2011-05-21T12:42:27  <amstan> idk why
2011-05-21T12:42:38  <amstan> https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/issues?sort=created&direction=desc&_pjax=true&state=open
2011-05-21T12:42:40  <amstan> top 3
2011-05-21T12:42:44  <McLeopold> that's the functional test settings...
2011-05-21T12:42:50  <amstan> yes, i know
2011-05-21T12:42:57  <amstan> also, some bots fail functional testing
2011-05-21T12:42:59  <McLeopold> I'll take a look
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2011-05-21T12:44:47  <amstan> there, it's up
2011-05-21T12:44:51  <demerzel> mine does
2011-05-21T12:44:52  <McLeopold> k
2011-05-21T12:44:55  <amstan> index.php page is annoying though
2011-05-21T12:44:59  <amstan> since memcached is empty
2011-05-21T12:44:59  <demerzel> but it might be because i rewrote it
2011-05-21T12:45:08  <demerzel> i still can't fidn anything wrong with it tho
2011-05-21T12:45:08  <amstan> let me bring the daemons up
2011-05-21T12:45:15  <demerzel> is the server set up for C#
2011-05-21T12:45:23  <demerzel> i assume so since it says compiled but who knows
2011-05-21T12:45:32  <amstan> demerzel: it is
2011-05-21T12:45:55  <amstan> http://pastebin.com/N7LBTc8D
2011-05-21T12:46:09  <demerzel> i dont even wanna make my botto in c# i thought it could be quick to make one for starter lol
2011-05-21T12:47:09  <amstan> McLeopold: http://hypertriangle.com:13080/ they're starving man!
2011-05-21T12:47:39  <McLeopold> they have food
2011-05-21T12:47:48  <McLeopold> I see food being created
2011-05-21T12:47:57  <amstan> oh, wait then for other games
2011-05-21T12:48:31  <amstan> McLeopold: well, still: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/issues/114
2011-05-21T12:48:39  <amstan> it gives you an example and the debug from the worker
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2011-05-21T12:49:49  <McLeopold> amstan: I bet it is a global variable that was set after a functional test, and didn't get set back
2011-05-21T12:50:08  <amstan> we shouldn't be using global variables
2011-05-21T12:50:15  <McLeopold> no, we shouldn't
2011-05-21T12:50:19  <amstan> there
2011-05-21T12:50:23  <amstan> wait.. nvm
2011-05-21T12:50:24  <amstan> it has food
2011-05-21T12:50:46  <amstan> also, why is it that sometimes the worker outputs all the orders, and sometimes it just outputs the turn lines?
2011-05-21T12:51:03  <McLeopold> probably same issue
2011-05-21T12:51:18  <amstan> in the same game though
2011-05-21T12:51:20  <McLeopold> the worker code got a little complicated, it's kind of messy
2011-05-21T12:51:23  <amstan> it just switches randomly
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2011-05-21T13:10:47  <demerzel> the replays are odd - so basically all food/ants are 'b' but then when the game starts it just randomly picks some of them to be real ants and others to be food?
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2011-05-21T14:15:11  <smiley1983> Can anyone suggest sane values for api_base_url and api_key in server_info.py? This is on a VM where the server will only be accessed locally (browser localhost)
2011-05-21T14:15:58  <smiley1983> I have apache2 running, website is accessible. Running worker.py fails, and I think it's because I left those two values mentioned above blank
2011-05-21T14:18:08  <amstan> smiley1983: are you using setup/setup_worker.py?
2011-05-21T14:18:54  <amstan> api_base_url should be where the worker can access the apache stuff, like http://localhost/api_something_somethin.php
2011-05-21T14:19:18  <amstan> and the key you get when you access api_server_setup.php
2011-05-21T14:19:21  <smiley1983> yes, I've run setup_worker.py successfully
2011-05-21T14:19:21  <amstan> from the worker
2011-05-21T14:19:37  <amstan> ignore everything except the key in there, the other stuff that the php outputs is out of date
2011-05-21T14:27:33  <smiley1983> okay... I think that fixed the problem, so now I've encountered the next problem: "file not returned by server" - but I'll have to look into that tomorrow after work, because it's time for sleep now. Thank you for your help in getting this far.
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2011-05-21T14:32:30  <Nebri> amstan: how many hours have you put into this so far?
2011-05-21T14:32:38  <amstan> Nebri: lost count
2011-05-21T14:32:45  <amstan> the logs might be an indication
2011-05-21T14:35:54  <Nebri> well now I know where you guys got your practice from for Mohawk. PathFinder did a great job on the mazes it did solve :)
2011-05-21T14:36:14  <Nebri> real shame that bug affected ya during the competition :(
2011-05-21T14:36:21  <Nebri> complete heartbreaker
2011-05-21T14:36:21  <amstan> i could have done better if it wasn't java
2011-05-21T14:36:32  <amstan> it was a pain to debug
2011-05-21T14:36:40  <amstan> i think i'll use jython next
2011-05-21T14:37:05  <Nebri> haven't played around with python yet
2011-05-21T14:37:21  <Nebri> procedural or oop for python?
2011-05-21T14:37:38  <amstan> opp probably
2011-05-21T14:37:53  <amstan> and i'll implement all thoes objects for compass and turn properly
2011-05-21T14:37:58  <amstan> so you can add them, and compare them
2011-05-21T14:38:07  <amstan> since java doesn't have operator overloading
2011-05-21T14:38:21  <Nebri> yea that is definitely a short coming of java :(
2011-05-21T14:38:30  <amstan> if it was up to me, that stuff should have been numbers, not objects
2011-05-21T14:38:42  <amstan> 0 for north, 1 for east up to 3
2011-05-21T14:38:50  <amstan> -1 for left, +1 for right
2011-05-21T14:38:53  <Nebri> you could have done that if you wanted to in your own class :)
2011-05-21T14:39:14  <amstan> yeah, but i already had some code dependent on it
2011-05-21T14:39:21  <Nebri> ah I see
2011-05-21T14:39:33  <amstan> i spent like 10 hours in total on it, i should have done more
2011-05-21T14:39:42  <Nebri> so how did you get involved with the google AI challegne that waterloo is running?
2011-05-21T14:39:54  <amstan> well, i used to be a student at waterloo
2011-05-21T14:40:08  <Nebri> comp science or other program?
2011-05-21T14:40:11  <amstan> cs yeah
2011-05-21T14:40:15  <amstan> i won the RPS competition
2011-05-21T14:40:22  <Nebri> RPS?
2011-05-21T14:40:23  <amstan> and i became an organizer for tron
2011-05-21T14:40:26  <amstan> rock paper scissors
2011-05-21T14:40:36  <Nebri> ah, didn't hear about that one. :)
2011-05-21T14:40:47  <amstan> i had like 100 ppl, mostly waterloo students
2011-05-21T14:40:56  <amstan> only in tron we became more popular
2011-05-21T14:41:11  <Nebri> the tron one looks really fun. I'm considering make a tron bot since all the materials needed are still available, just for the fun of it
2011-05-21T14:41:30  <amstan> we might run that again
2011-05-21T14:41:36  <amstan> maybe with 3vs3
2011-05-21T14:41:57  <Nebri> one AI controlling 3 lightcycles?
2011-05-21T14:42:08  <amstan> yes
2011-05-21T14:42:20  <amstan> or teams? that could work too
2011-05-21T14:42:33  <Nebri> teams would be harder to cordinate like that though'
2011-05-21T14:42:47  <Nebri> I think your better off with one AI controlling all three bots.
2011-05-21T14:42:53  <amstan> i guess
2011-05-21T14:43:09  <amstan> we were contemplating making future contests with communication in between bots
2011-05-21T14:43:17  <amstan> let them decide on a protocol, see what happens
2011-05-21T14:43:20  <Nebri> if nothing else, it'd go a long way in debugging cause three programmers and theres a bug, that'd be a nightmare to find and lots of finger pointing :P
2011-05-21T14:43:34  <amstan> by teams i mean random pairs
2011-05-21T14:43:52  <Nebri> kk
2011-05-21T14:43:52  <amstan> so you have to play nice with the others, even though you don't know who they are
2011-05-21T14:44:01  <Nebri> yea that could be interesting.
2011-05-21T14:44:53  <amstan> Nebri: how did you hear about the contest? my forum post?
2011-05-21T14:45:12  <Nebri> amstan: nah, good ol Google :)
2011-05-21T14:45:31  <Nebri> I stumbled upon it in the last couple weeks post amazebot. Started searching for other AI competitions
2011-05-21T14:49:03  <Nebri> love stuff like this, and currently unemployed at the moment. So looking for something fun to work on.
2011-05-21T14:49:14  <amstan> Nebri: yeah.. i know the feeling
2011-05-21T14:49:18  <amstan> Nebri: what program are you in?
2011-05-21T14:50:09  <Nebri> amstan: Software Development, and I just graduated from the Network Engineering & Security Analyst program at the end of 2009
2011-05-21T14:50:21  <amstan> cool
2011-05-21T14:50:24  <amstan> i'm doing comp eng
2011-05-21T14:50:39  <Nebri> is that more hardware related?
2011-05-21T14:50:43  <amstan> yeah
2011-05-21T14:50:47  <amstan> we have 1 programming class
2011-05-21T14:51:08  <amstan> i picked it because i wanted to stay away from c#
2011-05-21T14:51:56  <Nebri> heh :P. The new AI contest that me and aravin are discussing we're choosing C# as our language for development, to get students more exposure to whats out there in software development
2011-05-21T14:53:16  <amstan> what's it about?
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2011-05-21T14:53:59  <Nebri> no idea, he only approached me to ask if I would be interested in venturing into this with him and we tossed a couple game ideas for the AI's to play. As for right now I'm waiting for him to toss up a repo and get coding on a platform that we could use.
2011-05-21T14:54:37  <Nebri> absolutely nothing has been decided except for that I volunteered to help out the engine development.
2011-05-21T14:54:47  <amstan> cool
2011-05-21T14:54:47  <jbroman> amstan: You left CS?
2011-05-21T14:54:58  <amstan> jbroman: yeah, i was doing rather poor
2011-05-21T14:55:11  <amstan> might come back in a few years
2011-05-21T14:55:16  <jbroman> amstan: CompEng at ___?
2011-05-21T14:55:24  <amstan> mohawk college, hamilton
2011-05-21T14:55:33  <jbroman> I see. How's Hamilton?
2011-05-21T14:55:38  <Nebri> that's where I'm attending as well :)
2011-05-21T14:55:38  <amstan> good, home
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2011-05-21T14:58:02  * amstan wonders where jeff is
2011-05-21T14:58:42  <Nebri> any particular reason why you guys decided to go with ANTS for the next AI Challenge?
2011-05-21T14:58:57  <amstan> we like changing the contest every term
2011-05-21T14:59:07  <amstan> or else it wouldn't be fun, the barrier of entry would go higher and higher
2011-05-21T14:59:26  <Nebri> obviously :), but ants seems to be considerably more complex to me
2011-05-21T14:59:29  <amstan> there were lots of suggestions(http://ai-contest.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=21), we eventually went with ants
2011-05-21T14:59:37  <amstan> you should have seen the first proposal
2011-05-21T14:59:59  <amstan> one process per ant, and they had to communicate using scents
2011-05-21T15:00:05  <amstan> but that's not a lot of bandwidth
2011-05-21T15:00:28  <amstan> we eventually ditched it because of the computational power to run such a game
2011-05-21T15:01:00  <jbroman> I think ants is straining the boundaries of what the complexity should be. But on the other hand you don't want something for which excellent algorithms exist and can easily be found (e.g. chess).
2011-05-21T15:01:08  <Nebri> yea no kidding, one thread per ant? HA! :P
2011-05-21T15:01:36  <amstan> yeah, we even have docs for picking a contest subject: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/wiki/Game-Criteria
2011-05-21T15:03:09  <Nebri> very nice :)
2011-05-21T15:03:35  <Nebri> I'm very impressed with how you guys are running this contest so far. What kind of back end server do you have running this?
2011-05-21T15:03:53  <amstan> for tron we used the csclub resources at uwaterloo
2011-05-21T15:04:03  <amstan> we moved to amazon ec2 for planet wars
2011-05-21T15:04:20  <amstan> we'll probably stay with ec2, they're cheap
2011-05-21T15:04:54  <Nebri> yea and cloud computing is awesome no matter how you look at it :)
2011-05-21T15:04:57  <amstan> but pretty much any comp(with default ubuntu natty install) can become a worker
2011-05-21T15:05:09  <jbroman> Nice thing about EC2 is uniformity (= fairness).
2011-05-21T15:05:40  <Nebri> oh? so you guys are using a distrubted computing software to create a cloud on user/volunteer resources?
2011-05-21T15:05:55  <amstan> Nebri: we rolled our own
2011-05-21T15:06:04  <amstan> oh.. wait, no, nvm
2011-05-21T15:06:14  <Nebri> lol, I was gunna say! :P
2011-05-21T15:06:17  <amstan> we don't have volunteers for workers, security concerns
2011-05-21T15:06:36  <amstan> you don't want contestants to run their own bots on their hardware then send back the results
2011-05-21T15:07:14  <amstan> the rule is that anyone with system access on the live contest cannot compete
2011-05-21T15:07:22  <Nebri> which makes sense
2011-05-21T15:07:41  <Nebri> but you guys did roll out some software to create distrubuted computing cloud, but the contestants can't set up a worker pc?
2011-05-21T15:08:07  <Nebri> only organizers/volunteers who don't wish to compete?
2011-05-21T15:08:15  <jbroman> Nebri: The worker software runs on multiple machines. If you want to call that a cloud, sure.
2011-05-21T15:08:39  <amstan> Nebri: so far we only used ec2 for workers for uniformity, as jbroman said
2011-05-21T15:09:27  <Nebri> ah gotcha, so no cloud, just multiple machines running multiple instances
2011-05-21T15:09:40  <Nebri> with all the results being collected and displayed online?
2011-05-21T15:09:40  <amstan> yes
2011-05-21T15:09:50  <Nebri> makes much more sense now :)
2011-05-21T15:10:06  <amstan> Nebri: this might help: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/wiki/Beginner%27s-guide
2011-05-21T15:10:19  <amstan> i wrote that for a friend wanting to roll his own contest
2011-05-21T15:12:26  <Nebri> it's just such a good idea, and the turn out you guys got for tron was amazing. I'm sure planetwars was just as well (didn't look too much at planet wars)
2011-05-21T15:12:42  <amstan> we had 7 times more ppl for pw
2011-05-21T15:13:02  <Nebri> WHAT!?
2011-05-21T15:13:16  <Nebri> that is absolutely incredible :)
2011-05-21T15:13:36  <amstan> for tron we had 708 contestants
2011-05-21T15:13:39  <Nebri> funding must be a pain to get something of thise scope up and running though
2011-05-21T15:13:47  <amstan> and for planet wars we had 4600
2011-05-21T15:13:58  <amstan> not really, i think we spent like 500 bucks
2011-05-21T15:14:13  <jbroman> amstan: Only because of the immense amount of free labour. :P
2011-05-21T15:14:17  <amstan> yes
2011-05-21T15:15:07  <Nebri> yea, volunteers are awesome
2011-05-21T15:16:49  <amstan> Nebri: were you the bot that was going backwards the whole time?
2011-05-21T15:16:56  <Nebri> are all the games selected purely at random? or do you guys have some match making solution in the background?
2011-05-21T15:17:16  <amstan> some match making, the bots that didn't play against eachother
2011-05-21T15:17:19  <amstan> so we can rank them better
2011-05-21T15:17:25  <amstan> because we're not playing all vs all
2011-05-21T15:17:28  <amstan> that would be impossible
2011-05-21T15:17:56  <Nebri> right due to CPU power needed to make that happen.
2011-05-21T15:18:02  <Nebri> how many games then to establish elo?
2011-05-21T15:18:30  <amstan> the more you have the more accurate the results are
2011-05-21T15:18:50  <amstan> i don't remember how many games we had for planetwars at the end(for each submission)
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2011-05-21T15:36:48  <antimatroid> McLeopold: pong :P
2011-05-21T15:37:02  <McLeopold> antimatroid: dong
2011-05-21T15:37:57  <McLeopold> My son is holding a remote to his ear and babbling into it...
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2011-05-21T15:39:04  <McLeopold> antimatroid: either you forgot you pinged me or you are typing a novel...
2011-05-21T15:40:51  <antimatroid> (00:55:30) McLeopold: antimatroid: how goes it?
2011-05-21T15:40:52  <antimatroid> :p
2011-05-21T15:41:03  <antimatroid> you also said yesterday you wanted my maths :P
2011-05-21T15:41:10  <McLeopold> oh yeah
2011-05-21T15:41:30  <McLeopold> I implemented a food rate function, but wanted to make it cooler
2011-05-21T15:42:04  <antimatroid> is that why there is no food? :p;
2011-05-21T15:42:18  <Nebri> that would make a lot of sense :P
2011-05-21T15:42:41  <antimatroid> also, i think the server should show people the "test game" if they fail it
2011-05-21T15:42:47  <antimatroid> or at least be told why they failed it
2011-05-21T15:42:50  <McLeopold> given 2 numbers (#players, food per turn) can you make a function to return whole numbers of food for each player?  food_amount_per_player( turn#)
2011-05-21T15:44:12  <McLeopold> so, for a rate of 3 with 4 players, it should return 0,1,1,1,0,1,1,1,... for increasing values of turn#
2011-05-21T15:46:06  <antimatroid> i don't quite get that?
2011-05-21T15:46:20  <antimatroid> does it work for symmetric spawning?
2011-05-21T15:46:36  <antimatroid> i really don't care for asymmetric, i thought they'd suck, and any games i've seen on them suck :P
2011-05-21T15:47:13  <McLeopold> so if the rate is 3, then there should be 3 new foods per turn, but you only want to spawn food when you have enough for everyone
2011-05-21T15:47:38  <McLeopold> so at a rate of 3, the total amount spawned would be : 3,6,9,...
2011-05-21T15:47:39  <antimatroid> oh okay, yeah that's sick :)
2011-05-21T15:48:10  <McLeopold> the total amount handed out each turn would be: 0,4,4,4,0,4,4,4,...
2011-05-21T15:48:32  <McLeopold> so you just bank the food until you have enough to hand out evenly to all players
2011-05-21T15:48:38  <antimatroid> yep
2011-05-21T15:48:47  <McLeopold> I wanted that as a function
2011-05-21T15:49:03  <antimatroid> i didn't know it, but so did i, i was affraid of the amount of ants
2011-05-21T15:49:49  <McLeopold> I want that as a function.  I wrote it with an extra variable to keep track of left over food, but a function would be nicer, since you can calculate it.
2011-05-21T15:51:05  <McLeopold> btw, I turned the rate down to 1 food every 2 turns, so for a 5 player game, food spawns for everyone once every 10 turns.
2011-05-21T15:51:24  <antimatroid> there were a lot of 30 turn games yesterday with no food at all?
2011-05-21T15:51:34  <McLeopold> I've got that fixed.
2011-05-21T15:51:40  <McLeopold> It was bad code.
2011-05-21T15:51:58  <McLeopold> A case of oop done poorly.
2011-05-21T15:52:01  <antimatroid> my bot fails the test for some reason, amstan managed to break it yesterday but then i had to go out
2011-05-21T15:52:06  <antimatroid> so i need to work out what's causing that later
2011-05-21T15:52:11  <McLeopold> score one for the functional programmers.
2011-05-21T15:52:32  <McLeopold> I got your bot running on my system just fine.
2011-05-21T15:52:47  <amstan> McLeopold: it works on 4 players, but breaks on 2 players
2011-05-21T15:52:54  <McLeopold> oh
2011-05-21T15:53:35  <antimatroid> i don't get that still, i will play later though
2011-05-21T15:53:40  <antimatroid> the bot doesn't know how many players there are :\
2011-05-21T15:54:12  <McLeopold> antimatroid: so, can you solve my math question?
2011-05-21T15:54:42  <amstan> McLeopold: test_bot.sh is broken btw
2011-05-21T15:54:59  <McLeopold> feel free to fix it
2011-05-21T15:56:10  <McLeopold> I have a feeling it will include the lcm
2011-05-21T15:56:41  <CIA-48> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan fix_test_bot * rf7e9323 / ants/test_bot.sh : copied the options from play_one_game.sh - http://bit.ly/kOC4K4
2011-05-21T15:57:37  <amstan> oh!
2011-05-21T15:57:39  <amstan> it does work
2011-05-21T15:57:44  <amstan> i forgot python in this test
2011-05-21T16:04:56  <antimatroid> mcleopold: i can't make sense of what you want :P
2011-05-21T16:05:09  <antimatroid> "whole numbers of food for each player?  food_amount_per_player( turn#)"?
2011-05-21T16:05:33  <McLeopold> the food functions take a whole number, and multiply it by the number of players
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2011-05-21T16:06:10  <McLeopold> if I want a rate of 1 food spawned per turn, I should only call the food function once every x turns
2011-05-21T16:06:23  <McLeopold> where x in number of players
2011-05-21T16:06:39  <antimatroid> oh, i think i get it
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2011-05-21T16:07:18  <antimatroid> you want to call "food_amount_per_player( turn#)" and get how many squares to spawn that turn for each player?
2011-05-21T16:07:35  <McLeopold> so for a rate of 1 with 4 players, the function would be: f(1)=0, f(2)=0, f(3)=0, f(4)=1, ...
2011-05-21T16:08:02  <McLeopold> so the function would take turn#, #players and rate
2011-05-21T16:08:05  <antimatroid> do you want the engine to store an array of these values already calcualted? or to recalculate every turn?
2011-05-21T16:08:23  <McLeopold> I was hoping for a math answer, not a code answer
2011-05-21T16:08:33  <antimatroid> i could probably do the maths
2011-05-21T16:08:45  <antimatroid> but i don't think it'll be as fast as just storing the info in one sweep
2011-05-21T16:09:03  <CIA-48> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan epsilon * rf7e9323 / ants/test_bot.sh : copied the options from play_one_game.sh - http://bit.ly/kOC4K4
2011-05-21T16:09:03  <CIA-48> aichallenge: Alexandru Stan epsilon * rb204515 / ants/test_bot.cmd : fixed the windows one too - http://bit.ly/l1qvgu
2011-05-21T16:09:14  <McLeopold> yeah, probably
2011-05-21T16:09:30  <McLeopold> I could find the lcm, generate a schedule and loop through it
2011-05-21T16:09:30  <amstan> McLeopold: can you test if test_bot.cmd works on windows? i don't ahve access to one
2011-05-21T16:09:31  <antimatroid> anyway, i'll work it out
2011-05-21T16:09:43  <amstan> antimatroid: then use it on your bot, it'll time out
2011-05-21T16:09:45  <McLeopold> I'd have to use my win machine then...
2011-05-21T16:09:48  <amstan> antimatroid: it works for other bots
2011-05-21T16:10:22  <McLeopold> amstan: yes, I'll test, give me a few
2011-05-21T16:10:32  <amstan> or antimatroid could
2011-05-21T16:11:25  <antimatroid> i have windows installed, but it'd mean closing everything and restarting
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2011-05-21T16:13:35  <amstan> antimatroid: then do it in linux
2011-05-21T16:13:38  <antimatroid> i think you might be able to do it somewhat cheaply
2011-05-21T16:13:44  <amstan> antimatroid: it'll still demonstrate how your bot fails
2011-05-21T16:15:48  <antimatroid> i got it to time my bot out
2011-05-21T16:16:18  <antimatroid> hmm, okay cheers :)
2011-05-21T16:16:25  <antimatroid> at least i have something to test locally now
2011-05-21T16:18:02  <amstan> McLeopold: +1 for that thing btw, people can functionally test their bot now
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2011-05-21T16:18:09  <antimatroid> McLeopold: would this work... where N = players, R = rate, t = turn, food = floor(t.R/N) - floor((t-1)R/N)?
2011-05-21T16:18:25  <McLeopold> let me try...
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2011-05-21T16:20:04  <antimatroid> it requires floor(4(3)/4) == 4, not 3
2011-05-21T16:20:10  <antimatroid> ie. rounding could break it?
2011-05-21T16:24:42  <demerzel> whats teh average row/col
2011-05-21T16:24:52  <demerzel> for a visualizer just trying to get a feel for it
2011-05-21T16:24:55  <demerzel> 2938 is 80x104
2011-05-21T16:24:55  <antimatroid> what do you mean?
2011-05-21T16:25:07  <demerzel> i mean what are the bounds of map row/col
2011-05-21T16:25:13  <demerzel> and/or average/set amount
2011-05-21T16:25:18  <antimatroid> oh, that's completely undecided yet
2011-05-21T16:25:23  <antimatroid> the max is 256x256
2011-05-21T16:25:27  <demerzel> ah cool ty
2011-05-21T16:25:34  <antimatroid> but we wont every be able to feasibly use that
2011-05-21T16:25:42  <antimatroid> ever* (it's 6 30am :P)
2011-05-21T16:25:52  <demerzel> just trying to figure out if this 80x104 is an average size map or not
2011-05-21T16:26:04  <demerzel> leaves about 15pixels per at fullscreen
2011-05-21T16:26:34  <demerzel> also why the hell did we call them row/col i knwo i'm gonna be debugging that later
2011-05-21T16:26:38  <demerzel> already have to mentally switch x/y
2011-05-21T16:26:54  <antimatroid> don't use x/y
2011-05-21T16:27:11  <demerzel> i think that way i do call them row/col in code
2011-05-21T16:27:11  <antimatroid> then you have to mentally remember when you need to transpose the map for reading/writing information
2011-05-21T16:27:24  <antimatroid> if you use row/col, you never have to think about that again
2011-05-21T16:27:31  <antimatroid> it's how we index writing on pages
2011-05-21T16:27:37  <antimatroid> and it's how mathematicians index matrices
2011-05-21T16:27:43  <demerzel> hmm
2011-05-21T16:27:46  <antimatroid> programmers are silly for using x,y :P
2011-05-21T16:27:49  <demerzel> i am so used to plot points i guess
2011-05-21T16:27:54  <demerzel> i will buy that
2011-05-21T16:28:04  <demerzel> hey while you're talkative have you looked at replays
2011-05-21T16:28:06  <antimatroid> it was x,y
2011-05-21T16:28:11  <demerzel> it looks like maps are just 'b' for every possible food/ant
2011-05-21T16:28:17  <antimatroid> but i eventually convinced people it actually is annoying to do it that way :P
2011-05-21T16:28:18  <demerzel> and you have to decode the ants object to determine which turn which
2011-05-21T16:28:21  <demerzel> on turn 1 that is
2011-05-21T16:28:29  <demerzel> unless my map decoder is wrong
2011-05-21T16:28:36  <antimatroid> 'b'?
2011-05-21T16:28:56  <demerzel> yea looking at this
2011-05-21T16:28:57  <demerzel> http://hypertriangle.com:13080/game/2938
2011-05-21T16:29:24  <antimatroid> i have no idea about the replay format :P
2011-05-21T16:29:28  <demerzel> oh poo
2011-05-21T16:29:29  <demerzel> ok then
2011-05-21T16:29:50  <antimatroid> McLeopold?
2011-05-21T16:29:52  <antimatroid> Frontier?
2011-05-21T16:30:06  <demerzel> mcleopold: playercolors <array of html color codes>  = playerinfo?
2011-05-21T16:30:21  <demerzel> since playerinfo doesn't exist on the wiki and playercolors doesn't exist in the json
2011-05-21T16:31:01  <demerzel> if playerinfo wasn't a blank array i could probably answer that myself
2011-05-21T16:34:22  <McLeopold> what?
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2011-05-21T16:38:10  <McLeopold> demerzel: we haven't fully decided what to stuff in player_info yet
2011-05-21T16:38:27  <McLeopold> the wiki will always be the description that is out of date
2011-05-21T16:39:20  <McLeopold> I don't know where the b's came from, it looks like an issue
2011-05-21T16:39:28  <McLeopold> ending map state?
2011-05-21T16:42:25  <demerzel> i didn't look yet i was decodingt he initial map
2011-05-21T16:43:21  <demerzel> the weird thing is the initial map state has a billion ants 'b' and also food '*'
2011-05-21T16:43:25  <demerzel> it's just odd iand i'm not sure why
2011-05-21T16:43:48  <McLeopold> it would seem it's an end game state where player b won
2011-05-21T16:43:52  <demerzel> like if the ants turned into food on turn 1 that would make sense
2011-05-21T16:44:07  <demerzel> ohhhh so the map->data is endstate map?  that is news to me
2011-05-21T16:44:24  <McLeopold> I don't think it should be, but it wouldn't matter
2011-05-21T16:44:28  <demerzel> weird so basically to get the intiial state of a map you ignore anything but water
2011-05-21T16:44:31  <demerzel> that is odd
2011-05-21T16:44:45  <demerzel> or food i guess but that's covered in ants[]
2011-05-21T16:44:50  <demerzel> does that sound right?
2011-05-21T16:44:53  <McLeopold> it should be starting state, otherwise you don't know the start positions
2011-05-21T16:44:55  <antimatroid> McLeopold: did that food calc thing work?
2011-05-21T16:45:04  <demerzel> wouldn't you know from ants[]
2011-05-21T16:45:12  <McLeopold> antimatroid: I was hoping for something more cleaver
2011-05-21T16:45:15  <McLeopold> clever
2011-05-21T16:45:25  <antimatroid> that's cheap and easy :P
2011-05-21T16:46:24  <antimatroid> i'll try to work out something cooler
2011-05-21T16:46:31  <antimatroid> but i don't think it'll be as cheap
2011-05-21T16:46:58  <demerzel> mcleopold: look at this http://hypertriangle.com:13080/game/2938
2011-05-21T16:47:07  <demerzel> there are 628 'b' in the map->data
2011-05-21T16:47:26  <demerzel> on last turn http://hypertriangle.com:13080/visualizer.php?game=2938 there are 318 living ants
2011-05-21T16:48:09  <demerzel> i am not sure what that corresponds to
2011-05-21T16:49:46  <demerzel> there are 797 ants in the ants[] object
2011-05-21T16:50:06  <demerzel> only thing that it /might/ be is unique starting positions for those ants since i assume food can appear in teh same spot as an ant or other food has previously
2011-05-21T16:50:19  <demerzel> otherwise i am completely stumped as to why there are 628 'b' in teh initial map data
2011-05-21T16:52:43  <antimatroid> McLeopold: hmmmm :P
2011-05-21T16:52:53  <McLeopold> ?
2011-05-21T16:53:01  <antimatroid> if you do n = 5, r = 3, then you get food like 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 ..
2011-05-21T16:53:11  <antimatroid> i'm not sure how to calculate that nicer
2011-05-21T16:53:30  <demerzel> where is the thing that makes the replay data JSON
2011-05-21T16:53:31  <McLeopold> or r = 5, n = 3, 1,2,2,1,2,2
2011-05-21T16:53:35  <demerzel> i can just go look at that
2011-05-21T16:53:57  <McLeopold> demerzel: ants/ants.py look in get_state or get_replay
2011-05-21T16:54:02  <demerzel> ty
2011-05-21T17:00:43  <antimatroid> McLeopold: meh, just use floor :P
2011-05-21T17:08:51  <antimatroid> ""oh, but you don't have enough stat."Bitch. I can derive fucking stats right here right now." ahaha
2011-05-21T17:09:21  <demerzel> is this python for power of 2? d_col**2
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2011-05-21T17:10:51  <demerzel> oh god its not that simple
2011-05-21T17:11:08  <demerzel> leftover keywords jesus i hate python
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2011-05-21T17:31:46  <Nebri> lol, rapture's at 6 pm, not sure why you guys are even bothering with coding :P. XD XD
2011-05-21T17:37:05  <antimatroid> dude, it's 7 36am in australia, 22nd :P
2011-05-21T17:37:32  <Nebri> I know but it's 5:42 pm 21st here where we live :P
2011-05-21T17:37:36  <antimatroid> i was out riding at 6pm, no earthquakes, sorry :P
2011-05-21T17:37:36  <Nebri> the jokes still runnin
2011-05-21T17:38:10  <antimatroid> i wish i could have been there for the people who actually expected it
2011-05-21T17:38:14  <antimatroid> i am hoping for a video
2011-05-21T17:38:52  <Nebri> me too! :D
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2011-05-21T17:48:24  <demerzel> oh shit rapture already i'm still translating python
2011-05-21T17:48:29  <demerzel> hell of a way to go out
2011-05-21T17:49:27  <demerzel> gosh yea python is so readable this.revealed = [[[False for col in range(this.width)]
2011-05-21T17:49:37  <demerzel> oh mcleopold isn't here
2011-05-21T17:49:42  <Nebri> lol
2011-05-21T17:53:00  <demerzel> tbf i didn't have to do a line by line translation but i want my engine to be as close to the original as possible
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2011-05-21T17:59:09  <demerzel> does anybody know what this actually does
2011-05-21T17:59:09  <demerzel> score = [Fraction(0,1)]*this.num_players
2011-05-21T17:59:36  <demerzel> i really don't understand, it does an (0/1) = 0 * num_players but i'm not sure wtf the brackets do
2011-05-21T18:02:38  <okayzed> its a list builder: makes a list of size this filled with Fraction instances
2011-05-21T18:02:51  <demerzel> wait is that a really convoluted way of declaring an int array with all 0s
2011-05-21T18:03:09  <demerzel> granted there is no such thing as int in python afaik but for my mind thats how i think of it
2011-05-21T18:03:11  <okayzed> its not convoluted, if you know what it means
2011-05-21T18:03:34  <demerzel> so i will have an array with a length of num_players all 0'd right?
2011-05-21T18:03:53  <demerzel> assuming fraction(0, 1) isn't some kind of magic number in python
2011-05-21T18:11:02  <mcstar> i just hand-coded 586 coordinate indices
2011-05-21T18:12:40  <mcstar> and vim has trouble matching parantheses
2011-05-21T18:12:46  <mcstar> and indenting too
2011-05-21T18:14:18  <demerzel> coding in vim
2011-05-21T18:14:19  <demerzel> damn
2011-05-21T18:15:07  <mcstar> what?
2011-05-21T18:15:19  <mcstar> u swear emacs?
2011-05-21T18:15:24  <mcstar> (by)
2011-05-21T18:17:57  <okayzed> why did you hand code it?
2011-05-21T18:19:45  <mcstar> its fun to see a dense half page of parantheses
2011-05-21T18:20:08  <mcstar> i dont want to generate them at runtime
2011-05-21T18:20:29  <mcstar> its the indices of the radii that an ant can see
2011-05-21T18:20:49  <mcstar> and the spawn and the attack radii
2011-05-21T18:21:57  <demerzel> btw ty okayzed i would have had no idea what that was
2011-05-21T18:23:58  <mcstar> isnt it like multiplying a string?
2011-05-21T18:24:05  <mcstar> "something"*10000000
2011-05-21T18:24:20  <mcstar> then u get a lot of something which is almost anything
2011-05-21T18:26:07  <mcstar> talk to me people im bored :(
2011-05-21T18:26:30  <mcstar> im at the phase when programming is a chore
2011-05-21T18:28:50  <demerzel> havent gotten that far
2011-05-21T18:29:27  <mcstar> how far have u gotten? what is ur logic based on?
2011-05-21T18:31:00  <mcstar> im not asking you to reveal state secrets
2011-05-21T18:31:15  <mcstar> heuristics? genetic something?
2011-05-21T18:32:18  <mcstar> come on ppl, install a voice recognition software so that you can use irc while you code
2011-05-21T18:45:35  <demerzel> i am dissecting the engine atm
2011-05-21T18:45:42  <demerzel> only known about it for like 2 days
2011-05-21T18:54:32  <mcstar> really? why?
2011-05-21T18:55:01  <mcstar> i mean why do you want to see whats behind the engine?
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2011-05-21T19:07:54  <demerzel> why wouldn't i?
2011-05-21T19:08:12  <demerzel> specifically though i'm making a debugger so it's vital i can replicate the engine
2011-05-21T19:14:52  <mcstar> a debugger for what?
2011-05-21T19:15:02  <mcstar> for the official game engine?
2011-05-21T19:15:53  <mcstar> but to develop your own bot i dont see why would you need to know how the engine works
2011-05-21T19:16:15  <mcstar> if it interests you thats ok, im just saying that it consumes your time
2011-05-21T19:18:48  <demerzel> so does writing an ai bot
2011-05-21T19:28:28  <mcstar> ill be outside if anyone needs me just shout
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2011-05-21T20:04:27  <demerzel> are the coordinates received absolute or relative?
2011-05-21T20:04:42  <demerzel> ie if i get an ant coord at 8, 9 then is that absolute 8,9 or relative to what i can see
2011-05-21T20:04:47  <demerzel> or have seen
2011-05-21T20:04:50  <olexs1> absolute
2011-05-21T20:04:56  <demerzel> awesome ty
2011-05-21T20:05:09  <olexs1> at least I handle them as such and it seems to work :)
2011-05-21T20:05:30  <mcstar> i cant imagine relative coordinates in this context
2011-05-21T20:05:31  <demerzel> just setting up search trees and if it was relative it juts got a lot more complex
2011-05-21T20:05:42  <demerzel> you would be surprised at the shit in the engine
2011-05-21T20:05:53  <demerzel> i don't know if it uses it but it's got bfs, tracking per player of explored etc
2011-05-21T20:06:01  <mcstar> did you mean shift?
2011-05-21T20:06:01  <demerzel> i haven't fully translated it yet so i wasn't sure
2011-05-21T20:06:04  <mcstar> (joke)
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2011-05-21T20:29:53  <amstan> antimatroid: how's your bot?
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2011-05-21T21:04:04  <demerzel> amstan: do you guys know the problem behind the 30 turn no food games?
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2011-05-21T21:13:11  <amstan> demerzel: mcleopold might
2011-05-21T21:13:27  <demerzel> ah just noticed it was still there and i know you talked about it last night
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2011-05-21T22:33:01  <demerzel> amstan: is worker down?
2011-05-21T22:33:26  <demerzel> was putting in a glorified go-bot just to see if it would take it
2011-05-21T22:35:54  <demerzel> and it did not
2011-05-21T22:36:13  <demerzel> i have to officially say i think the test is not right because that bot worked fine using ants.py locally
2011-05-21T22:42:25  <amstan_> demerzel: should be up
2011-05-21T22:42:31  <demerzel> worker is up yes
2011-05-21T22:42:39  <demerzel> but bot failed despite working fine locally
2011-05-21T22:42:44  <amstan_> how did it fail?
2011-05-21T22:43:07  <amstan_> you should try testing it with ants/test_bot.sh
2011-05-21T22:43:10  <amstan_> git pull first
2011-05-21T22:43:19  <amstan_> i just fixed that script today
2011-05-21T22:43:30  <amstan_> antimatroid had it fail with it
2011-05-21T22:43:32  <amstan_> so..
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2011-05-21T22:43:54  <demerzel> yea i get an error with test_bot.bat
2011-05-21T22:44:06  <demerzel> it works when doing play_one_game
2011-05-21T22:44:12  <demerzel> i mean it doesn't do jack but it doesn't break either
2011-05-21T22:44:20  <demerzel> just my test case to see if i could get anything to upload period
2011-05-21T22:45:22  <demerzel> amstan: i get this error (sorry windows) running it http://pastebin.com/ABMCXd5L
2011-05-21T22:45:56  <demerzel> i had to take out the -o viewer part too otherwise i got 'got 3 bots expected 2' error
2011-05-21T22:46:22  <amstan> demerzel: as i said, git pull first
2011-05-21T22:46:32  <demerzel> i am not working with a clone atm i have too many repos already
2011-05-21T22:46:36  <demerzel> but i will pull the latest
2011-05-21T22:46:46  <amstan> you only need one..
2011-05-21T22:46:52  <demerzel> this is yesterday
2011-05-21T22:47:02  <demerzel> have you changed play_game or test_bot.sh since then?
2011-05-21T22:47:05  <amstan> i have one, and i merge like daily, maintain a test server and so on
2011-05-21T22:47:38  <demerzel> ah yea you have
2011-05-21T22:47:39  <demerzel> ok
2011-05-21T22:48:13  <demerzel> i recommend adding a pause to the end of the .cmd
2011-05-21T22:48:25  <demerzel> in windows it doesn't keep the command window open after an error if you do that
2011-05-21T22:48:38  <demerzel> probably less problems with people asking why it broke down the ilne if you add pause to the end lol
2011-05-21T22:48:39  <amstan> isn't there like a right click option for that?
2011-05-21T22:48:54  <demerzel> if there is i've missed it for the last ~10 years
2011-05-21T22:50:26  <demerzel> actually when i get this done i'll give you a windows version
2011-05-21T22:50:36  <demerzel> moving the %1 to a variable to set
2011-05-21T22:50:53  <demerzel> it's much less of a pain in the ass to just edit that variable than open a command window and navigate wherever the hell
2011-05-21T22:51:10  <amstan> as i said before.. you're doing it wrong
2011-05-21T22:52:59  <demerzel> no you just refuse to consider that people don't use unix-based :P
2011-05-21T22:53:17  <demerzel> some* people
2011-05-21T22:53:23  <demerzel> most afaik
2011-05-21T22:54:06  <demerzel> hmm now it times out
2011-05-21T22:54:27  <demerzel> is the --end-wait 0.25 giving it 0.25 before a timeout?  does that include initial?  it might take more than 250ms for it to spin up
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2011-05-21T23:04:09  <demerzel> amstan i really have no damn idea - i yanked the parsing code straight out of my pw bot and it's still saying timed out
2011-05-21T23:05:34  <demerzel> oh well guess it's verbose logging to file time
2011-05-21T23:20:50  <demerzel> omfg i think i figured it out haha
2011-05-21T23:21:02  <demerzel> i missed that we have to send go prior to turn 1
2011-05-21T23:31:39  <demerzel> ok what am i doing wrong here
2011-05-21T23:31:41  <demerzel> http://pastebin.com/Sa76Yqsi
2011-05-21T23:31:44  <demerzel> i am now getting to turn 1
2011-05-21T23:31:52  <demerzel> 2 ms processing inital settings
2011-05-21T23:31:57  <demerzel> then 14 ms processing turn 1 data
2011-05-21T23:32:02  <demerzel> at 16 ms i send 'go\n'
2011-05-21T23:32:07  <demerzel> and play_game times me out
2011-05-21T23:32:40  <demerzel> amstan: i would greatly appreciate iti you could look at that log, it logs everything i send/receive and has a turnelapsed ms timer
2011-05-21T23:32:53  <demerzel> i have no idea why its timing out on turn 1 unless i am missing something
2011-05-21T23:33:17  <amstan> demerzel: i don't actually know anything more about the bots
2011-05-21T23:33:22  <amstan> idk anything about the protocol
2011-05-21T23:33:37  <demerzel> crap
2011-05-21T23:33:52  <demerzel> i have it logging everything and i see zero problem with it (after i figured out i was suppsoed to send a go on turn 0)
2011-05-21T23:34:11  <amstan> demerzel: did you flush the outputs and inputs after every read?
2011-05-21T23:34:36  <demerzel> i've done both ways but it accepted the first 'go\n'
2011-05-21T23:34:45  <demerzel> last yeari  didn't need to but i will ptu it back in to see if it helps since i am further along now
2011-05-21T23:35:39  <demerzel> nope same thing :(
2011-05-21T23:36:47  <demerzel> tried making it wait 100ms before sending go
2011-05-21T23:36:50  <demerzel> didn't work either
2011-05-21T23:37:13  <amstan> demerzel: so you did flush the outputs?
2011-05-21T23:37:28  <demerzel> i took it out but put it back in when you said something jic
2011-05-21T23:37:32  <demerzel> didn't make a diff
2011-05-21T23:37:46  <demerzel> manual flushing is back in there
2011-05-21T23:38:05  <demerzel> it takes the first 'go\n' becuase it was stopping there before
2011-05-21T23:38:20  <demerzel> maybe i have to move or it kills it
2011-05-21T23:38:31  <demerzel> i'll put in a 'move north' every turn lol
2011-05-21T23:38:48  <amstan> demerzel: try doing the same type of debugging on another bot
2011-05-21T23:38:49  <amstan> that works
2011-05-21T23:38:51  <amstan> see what they output
2011-05-21T23:39:11  <demerzel> well problem is other bots are other languages
2011-05-21T23:39:24  <demerzel> i'm almost positive it's a .NET stdio problem or i'm just missing something
2011-05-21T23:39:25  <amstan> so?
2011-05-21T23:39:47  <amstan> well, i have a feeling you're not compliant to the protocol
2011-05-21T23:39:51  <amstan> see what the other bots do
2011-05-21T23:40:05  <demerzel> you mgiht be right i'll look if this doesn't work
2011-05-21T23:42:06  <demerzel> oh thank god i found it
2011-05-21T23:42:07  <demerzel> extra newline
2011-05-21T23:42:17  <demerzel> floating out in the ether
2011-05-21T23:44:23  <demerzel> May 21st 23:43:59 	successfully entered into contest 	C#
2011-05-21T23:44:24  <demerzel> woop
2011-05-21T23:44:37  <demerzel> i've got your starter package haha just needed 1 damn line
2011-05-21T23:47:45  <demerzel> You can upload your code as often as you want.
2011-05-21T23:47:46  <demerzel> Sorry, you have to wait at least 10 minutes between submissions.