2011-07-15T00:05:42 *** janzert has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-07-15T00:24:41 looking some starter packages, i can't find how or where the "end" parameter is managed ? 2011-07-15T00:25:17 bots just should halt on a eof error ?? 2011-07-15T00:28:54 also in http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/specification.php i think there's a typo, or i've missunderstood something 2011-07-15T00:29:14 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T00:29:14 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2011-07-15T00:29:51 sample input for player b should be : end / players 2 / score 0 1 / go 2011-07-15T00:29:53 no ? 2011-07-15T00:41:03 also the forum link in the sidebar is broken, should be http://ai-contest.com/forums/index.php :) 2011-07-15T00:44:39 that's it.. hiding the introductions forum 2011-07-15T00:44:41 so much spam.. 2011-07-15T00:47:03 arf, ok :) 2011-07-15T00:47:32 or not? 2011-07-15T00:47:54 but the link here http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/faq.php is correct so spam will flow anyway :D 2011-07-15T00:49:17 aichallenge: Alexandru Stan epsilon * r5d6f220 / website/menu.php : made the link to the forums to be absolute - http://bit.ly/r334PO 2011-07-15T00:50:52 fbparis: happy? lol 2011-07-15T00:50:55 anyway spammers don't find the way to the forum by following such links, but with some footprints in search engine results... 2011-07-15T00:51:06 oh don't specialy care, just to help.. 2011-07-15T00:51:23 if we want the forums to be popular it'll also be popular with the spammers 2011-07-15T00:51:32 there's no point in hiding it 2011-07-15T00:52:31 but ther's a proverb: to live happy, live hidden :p 2011-07-15T00:52:48 (especially if you're rich) 2011-07-15T01:14:27 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T01:19:17 amstan any ideas what is wrong with the rankings page 2011-07-15T01:19:34 bhasker: what about them? 2011-07-15T01:19:36 ew? 2011-07-15T01:19:38 lol 2011-07-15T01:19:45 only 11 ranks :) 2011-07-15T01:19:47 interesting.. 2011-07-15T01:19:55 @rankings 20 2011-07-15T01:19:59 amstan: Top 20 players: sir_macelon(100.0), FlagCapper(99.9), GreenTea(85.8), Sto03RepliCrush(84.6), Zaphus(82.3), OlexandrT(82.2), pachalmars(81.1), Zaphtest02(80.2), davidjliu(79.4), incoherent(79.2), antimatroid(78.2) 2011-07-15T01:20:09 that's only 11 dude.. lol 2011-07-15T01:20:37 :) 2011-07-15T01:20:41 contestbot: later tell mcleopold something funny with the db seems to be happening, there's only 11 ranked ppl 2011-07-15T01:20:41 amstan: I come to serve. 2011-07-15T01:39:52 *** foRei has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-07-15T01:46:36 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T02:23:42 *** mcstar has left #aichallenge ("WeeChat 0.3.5") 2011-07-15T02:26:24 *** mleise has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T02:55:44 bhasker, jmcarthur: would the reintroduction of home bases that need to be protected add more strategy? 2011-07-15T02:56:05 there would be quite a few complaints about such a change so late though :\ 2011-07-15T02:57:55 you also can give up ants and plug the bots on Starcraft 2 :) 2011-07-15T02:58:13 =-O 2011-07-15T03:03:57 *** Accoun has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2011-07-15T03:28:01 *** ltriant has quit IRC (Quit: Get MacIrssi - http://www.sysctl.co.uk/projects/macirssi/) 2011-07-15T04:04:18 amstan: Hey, how are you? 2011-07-15T04:07:12 *** janzert has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T04:12:35 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T04:23:33 *** berak has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T04:45:36 *** mceier has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T04:54:39 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2011-07-15T05:10:47 *** _flag <_flag!~flag@69-165-173-172.dsl.teksavvy.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Lost terminal) 2011-07-15T05:16:44 mmmmm, butter chicken 2011-07-15T05:17:09 oh yeah! 2011-07-15T05:17:12 3 week waiting is over 2011-07-15T05:30:50 *** eashoka has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T05:39:27 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CLwxObfaNE&NR=1 2011-07-15T05:39:51 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T05:50:15 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:05:24 *** Accoun has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-07-15T06:18:11 *** _will_sell_5_BTC <_will_sell_5_BTC!~1@static-213-88-39-97.chebnet.ru> has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:18:48 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:29:09 *** onensora has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:29:17 *** Kingpin13 has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:30:27 aichallenge: marco epsilon * rbe8b6f1 / (4 files in 2 dirs): visualizer: fixed zoom out button doing nothing for a few clicks and zooming out of "row= col="-mode causing a grid pattern on the second click - http://bit.ly/mPaYnP 2011-07-15T06:36:02 *** eashoka has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T06:52:41 *** MikeTheAnt2 has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T06:53:10 Anyone here with some experience with the AI challenge compiler? Don't know how to fix my code 2011-07-15T06:54:55 timeouts? 2011-07-15T06:55:03 yep 2011-07-15T06:55:15 Compiled ok but failed test cases 2011-07-15T06:55:19 I made in in C# 2011-07-15T06:55:37 *it 2011-07-15T07:06:23 *** Kevin___ has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T07:06:45 after how many matches, does one get a ranking?? 2011-07-15T07:07:37 after first match 2011-07-15T07:07:43 there is a bug going on right now 2011-07-15T07:07:51 and sys develpers has been informed 2011-07-15T07:08:30 aichallenge: marco epsilon * rc6b0c53 / ants/visualizer/java/com/aicontest/visualizer/js/dom/ApplicationLocalStorage.java : visualizer: fixed incorrect storage of configuration preferences for the Java visualizer in the Java user preferences root ('.java/.userPrefs/prefs.xml') - http://bit.ly/nhzDkZ 2011-07-15T07:08:37 *** sir_macelon has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T07:08:39 hi 2011-07-15T07:09:17 rabidus: Ok, so I should do nothing to my bot now? 2011-07-15T07:09:49 that was for the rankings 2011-07-15T07:10:04 you should check your source code and check that your bot doesn't do any illegal moves 2011-07-15T07:10:24 antimatroid: it would be one way to do it, yes 2011-07-15T07:10:37 for ie. you are not trying to move someone others ant etc. 2011-07-15T07:10:50 antimatroid: it would also make it a very hard game 2011-07-15T07:11:03 compared to now 2011-07-15T07:11:48 rabidus: i dont think that'd be a problem 2011-07-15T07:11:50 because it would be win/lose instead of scored, so you can't just look a few turns ahead to see what is locally best to do 2011-07-15T07:13:42 rabidus: ok, thanks 2011-07-15T07:13:50 but that was just a guess 2011-07-15T07:14:53 Difficult to debug as it works on my local game engine. Why is there different rules on the one you download than the one on the server? 2011-07-15T07:15:04 there arent 2011-07-15T07:15:09 you just dont have the latest 2011-07-15T07:15:20 ok 2011-07-15T07:15:34 So I sould update then 2011-07-15T07:15:36 thanks 2011-07-15T07:17:26 Is there a version indicated somewhere? 2011-07-15T07:17:44 i dont think so 2011-07-15T07:17:54 ok 2011-07-15T07:18:01 judt download the archive from github 2011-07-15T07:18:54 ok, will do, thanks 2011-07-15T07:19:24 we should version the tools 2011-07-15T07:20:42 jmcarthur: you like extra complications? 2011-07-15T07:20:59 it would make it easier to knwo when you are out-of-date. 2011-07-15T07:21:41 then you'd have to read changelogs 2011-07-15T07:21:55 but this way, you always test with the lates, before you try uploding 2011-07-15T07:22:01 latestr 2011-07-15T07:22:03 helll 2011-07-15T07:22:41 true, it is difficult when there are a lot of versions released all the time. 2011-07-15T07:27:49 *** Kevin___ has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T07:28:05 *** jmreardon has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T07:28:49 hmm.. guess I do something wrong; I did download the latest version but it lacks the "engine" file (among other things). 2011-07-15T07:30:51 lol 2011-07-15T07:30:57 what did you do? 2011-07-15T07:31:22 I grabbed the Ants zip from the GIT. Probably not the way it should be done.. :) 2011-07-15T07:31:48 https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge 2011-07-15T07:31:55 and click the download on the right side 2011-07-15T07:32:02 it this is what you did, thats alrgith 2011-07-15T07:32:29 (my fingers are dislexic it seems) 2011-07-15T07:33:00 that's what I did.. 2011-07-15T07:33:15 ohh, wait, I went in to the ants folder and did just that 2011-07-15T07:33:17 so, how do you know something is missing? 2011-07-15T07:33:32 It wont run 2011-07-15T07:33:45 did you extract the whole archive? 2011-07-15T07:33:52 And the file "engine" is missing 2011-07-15T07:34:23 ? 2011-07-15T07:36:03 sry, I'm probably doing it wrong. I just grabbed the zip, extracted it and then tried to start the "play_one_game" batch file. 2011-07-15T07:37:18 c:\Projects\Antfarm\Tools2>play_one_game_custom.cmd Traceback (most recent call last): File "c:\Projects\Antfarm\Tools2\playgame.py", line 18, in from engine import run_game Import Error: No module named engine 2011-07-15T07:37:54 and the file "engine", that I got earlier when I downloaded this, is missing in the new folder I just extracted 2011-07-15T07:38:32 waaaaait 2011-07-15T07:38:35 where are those files? 2011-07-15T07:38:53 thats why i was asking you "did you extract everything?" 2011-07-15T07:39:01 it needs its directory structure 2011-07-15T07:39:14 the playgame.py whihch is inside ants/ 2011-07-15T07:39:26 needs the engine.py which is in worker/ 2011-07-15T07:39:32 ok? 2011-07-15T07:39:40 dont pull those files out of their place 2011-07-15T07:40:00 just move the whole extracted folder 2011-07-15T07:40:06 wherever you like it 2011-07-15T07:43:36 yeah, now I got it. thanks! 2011-07-15T07:44:00 np 2011-07-15T07:44:01 And I also got the same problem with my bot, so it's time to do some debuging! :) 2011-07-15T08:02:39 *** Allied_Envy has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-07-15T08:27:23 *** mcstar has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5) 2011-07-15T08:33:53 aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * r37492b7 / (7 files in 3 dirs): visualizer: Live visualizer crash fixed; now showing 'd' lines (dead ants) as smaller darker ants in live view - http://bit.ly/qBD6U5 2011-07-15T08:36:38 MikeTheAnt2: there are tools archives online 2011-07-15T08:36:41 @tools 2011-07-15T08:36:42 mleise: tools could be Windows: http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/tools.zip | Linux/MacOS X: http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/tools.tar.bz2. 2011-07-15T08:40:26 aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * r80ecd18 / ants/visualizer/java/com/aicontest/visualizer/js/dom/ApplicationLocalStorage.java : visualizer: Live visualizer settings could not be saved when set back to default values - http://bit.ly/mSl4zs 2011-07-15T08:48:02 aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * raab23df / ants/visualizer/js/Application.js : 2011-07-15T08:48:02 aichallenge: visualizer: clicking on the time bar in the live visualizer did not jump to the correct position (because the turn limit was the base for the position 2011-07-15T08:48:02 aichallenge: calculation instead of the actual duration) - http://bit.ly/ornVXU 2011-07-15T08:52:35 *** AlliedEnvy has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T08:56:52 aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * re06af1c / ants/visualizer/js/Application.js : visualizer: removed player button updating from live visualizer, the reordering was confusing and led to the visualizer area resizing - http://bit.ly/rn8IH1 2011-07-15T09:09:09 *** UvAnts has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:11:12 *** eashoka has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:11:49 Hi... I need help creating an account. I signed up with the username 'UvAnts' last night, but have not received any confirmation email. It's not in my junk folder either. Any ideas who I can contact? 2011-07-15T09:14:40 for the beta site no confirmation email will be sent (AFAIK) all you have to do is to click the link 'activate account' in the page appearing immediately after creating the user and you are set. but you have a problem now as you no longer have that page, suggest you create a new account and this time don't loose the reply page of user creation. :-) 2011-07-15T09:24:48 just noticed that the ranking page works for the 2nd page when typing the url as http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/rankings.php?page=2. (at least the whole page with all entries below 99 appears) wonder why it's broken only for the first page..... 2011-07-15T09:28:29 aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * r06813f0 / (3 files): visualizer: disabled shadows for Firefox 5 and Chrome 12 where they did more harm than good - http://bit.ly/pqMV6u 2011-07-15T09:41:13 *** humanfromearth has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:42:36 *** savanus has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:44:44 *** foRei has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:44:57 *** savanus has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2011-07-15T09:53:08 *** choas has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:56:07 eashoka, thanks for the reply :) 2011-07-15T09:56:54 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T09:57:12 morning 2011-07-15T09:57:20 afternoon 2011-07-15T09:57:43 how is your bot doing? 2011-07-15T09:57:47 72 ish! 2011-07-15T09:57:53 hanging out around that point 2011-07-15T09:58:07 are there enought games? 2011-07-15T09:58:13 yea 2011-07-15T09:58:14 i wasnt paying much attention to that 2011-07-15T10:00:00 i think my bot's basic strategy is now fine, need to add intelligence for it to make more intelligent decisions about whom to attack and when 2011-07-15T10:01:20 and i realized i need to make a few more changes when checking out moves as i move the ants serially one after the other and sometimes ants may move positions after i used them to resolve a battle 2011-07-15T10:01:25 antimat. said his bot is pretty simple, but still holds 11th, right? 2011-07-15T10:01:29 which makes for suboptimal moves 2011-07-15T10:01:38 i doubt his bot is as simple as he claims:) 2011-07-15T10:01:48 yo think? :D 2011-07-15T10:01:52 yea 2011-07-15T10:04:17 how is your bot doing? 2011-07-15T10:04:31 btw anyone here know where the tcp server code is 2011-07-15T10:04:36 i might take a stab at getting it working 2011-07-15T10:06:28 you can find it in mcleo's github repository, or a modded one in b.erak's 2011-07-15T10:06:35 as far as i know 2011-07-15T10:06:47 im writing a state-transition logic right now 2011-07-15T10:06:56 a sort of decision-table wtf 2011-07-15T10:08:30 *** sir_macelon has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T10:10:03 i have mcleo's copy but thats for planetwars 2011-07-15T10:10:09 if berak has done some work to get it working for ants 2011-07-15T10:10:15 then i will use his as a base 2011-07-15T10:10:17 do you have a link 2011-07-15T10:10:47 put it down, wait a sec, goin to put it up again 2011-07-15T10:16:20 how far along are you in getting it working berak? 2011-07-15T10:16:40 if i get it up and running i am thinking we can set it to run on an AWS micro instance 2011-07-15T10:17:01 the free tier lets one setup a single micro instance, i can just host it there for now 2011-07-15T10:17:22 micro instance should be sufficient to run a few games 2011-07-15T10:17:31 we can setup a few of them with different aws accounts for people to play 2011-07-15T10:18:03 can you mail me the link to your repo at hbhasker at yahoo dot com 2011-07-15T10:18:17 i have to step out right now, but will take a stab at it and see if i can get some stuff done 2011-07-15T10:18:24 oh, got pretty lazy, let me put it on github again 2011-07-15T10:20:40 73.29 oh goodie goodie 2011-07-15T10:20:48 http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/visualizer.php?game=86357&user=13 2011-07-15T10:20:53 mcstar a game that my bot just won 2011-07-15T10:24:26 bhasker: its kind of jittery, when ants are idle, you just move them around randomly? 2011-07-15T10:24:56 well they move to the oldest square around them 2011-07-15T10:25:01 each ant tracks its history 2011-07-15T10:25:08 and just moves to oldest square around it 2011-07-15T10:25:22 seems to work fine for exploring 2011-07-15T10:25:35 hm, i havent thought of that 2011-07-15T10:25:41 i had some complicated logic of figuring out frontlines etc 2011-07-15T10:25:51 i was doing some tests with a kind of potential method 2011-07-15T10:25:52 but that took too much cpu and just didnt work right 2011-07-15T10:25:59 yea i tried potential earlier too 2011-07-15T10:26:07 im gonna use it i think 2011-07-15T10:26:08 but that would get stuck in local maxima's etc 2011-07-15T10:26:18 ants would just sit and do nothing 2011-07-15T10:26:23 well, id use it for spreading 2011-07-15T10:26:33 well your potential calculations better be stable 2011-07-15T10:26:37 otherwise ants do stupid things 2011-07-15T10:26:50 this strategy seems to work fine for me 2011-07-15T10:26:51 for now 2011-07-15T10:27:06 ant expands pretty fast 2011-07-15T10:27:07 its not ONLY potential based, it just would give them a general direction, where are less ants of its own kind 2011-07-15T10:27:08 it could do better 2011-07-15T10:27:25 ah k 2011-07-15T10:27:30 you seem to move multiple ants for the same food though 2011-07-15T10:27:38 that can happen 2011-07-15T10:27:44 since i give orders serially 2011-07-15T10:27:55 sometimes the closest ant gets its orders later 2011-07-15T10:28:06 so you may see multiple ants move at the same time 2011-07-15T10:28:13 also i have a concept of adhoc squad formations 2011-07-15T10:28:22 when an enemy is encountered, ants will move as a squad 2011-07-15T10:28:28 you dont remove the food, that has an ant associated? 2011-07-15T10:28:38 i don't 2011-07-15T10:28:49 since my current code doesn't always find the closest ant for the food 2011-07-15T10:28:55 ok 2011-07-15T10:28:56 it just picks an ant and routes it to closest food to that ant 2011-07-15T10:29:01 so i track path lengths to each food 2011-07-15T10:29:07 from the closest ant 2011-07-15T10:29:17 and if i find another ant with a shorter path to the same food i let it go at it 2011-07-15T10:30:17 i dont see the squads 2011-07-15T10:30:22 or any formation 2011-07-15T10:30:30 well not technically formation let me show you 2011-07-15T10:30:42 they don't persist across turns 2011-07-15T10:32:05 this game is probably not the best 2011-07-15T10:32:07 let me find another 2011-07-15T10:33:28 the problem is my stupid bot is always coming 2nd or 3rd! 2011-07-15T10:33:30 rarely first 2011-07-15T10:33:39 :) 2011-07-15T10:33:51 coming first is a bitch, i dont want it 2011-07-15T10:33:52 you would thinkg that at 73 rating it would win at least 1-2 games every now and then 2011-07-15T10:35:40 if you watch this game http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/visualizer.php?game=83495&user=13 2011-07-15T10:35:52 youw ill see occassionaly ants will cluster together kill an enemy ant 2011-07-15T10:35:54 and then spread out 2011-07-15T10:35:56 again 2011-07-15T10:36:05 thats usually a squad formed and disbandded 2011-07-15T10:38:00 anyway gotta run now 2011-07-15T10:38:03 l8rs 2011-07-15T10:38:20 bb 2011-07-15T11:07:50 *** fbparis has left #aichallenge 2011-07-15T11:19:19 *** eashoka has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-07-15T11:29:45 *** rabidus has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-07-15T11:30:00 *** sigh has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-07-15T11:45:05 *** rabidus has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T11:53:06 *** humanfromearth has left #aichallenge 2011-07-15T12:04:58 *** UvAnts has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T12:05:55 *** sergey__ has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T12:06:20 *** sergey__ is now known as SSNikolaevich 2011-07-15T12:09:25 *** SSNikolaevich has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-07-15T12:20:14 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T12:20:14 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2011-07-15T12:27:00 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2011-07-15T12:41:18 *** Palmik has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-07-15T12:42:08 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T13:10:46 *** confab has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-07-15T13:18:43 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T13:18:43 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2011-07-15T13:21:40 *** bhasker_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T13:21:48 *** bhasker has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2011-07-15T13:24:49 *** confab has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:04:50 *** sir_macelon has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:04:59 hi 2011-07-15T14:07:34 why do i see 2 amstan and 3 accoun? 2011-07-15T14:07:47 mleise: there's only 1 amstan 2011-07-15T14:07:51 i think my irc client is broken 2011-07-15T14:07:54 reconnect? 2011-07-15T14:08:26 mmm...no the chat is still working 2011-07-15T14:09:07 are there any news about the ranking page? it got stuck on some old data 2011-07-15T14:09:10 amstan: what is the status of our little project? 2011-07-15T14:09:21 little? 2011-07-15T14:09:41 compared to kde yes 2011-07-15T14:10:42 compared to kde everything is little 2011-07-15T14:11:54 eclipse isn't little compared to kde, but what is the status mr project manager :p 2011-07-15T14:12:16 well.. we still have a bunch of bugs 2011-07-15T14:12:21 i would even help you out with it, but you don't use java apparently 2011-07-15T14:12:30 pretty big ones: http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/rankings.php 2011-07-15T14:12:46 that's a short list 2011-07-15T14:12:51 yes 2011-07-15T14:13:02 and i think janzert and mcleopold are busy for a week 2011-07-15T14:13:23 ok that explains the problem with the ranking page 2011-07-15T14:14:11 are there other blockers? 2011-07-15T14:14:24 no, i think that's it 2011-07-15T14:15:17 great :) so the workers don't die any more when there are http problems? 2011-07-15T14:16:03 I had mercy with FF5 and disabled the button shadows there. And for Chrome 12 as well, since they weren't blurred there 2011-07-15T14:16:37 oh yay.. gcc is done compiling 2011-07-15T14:16:54 gcc is one hell of a compile :/ 2011-07-15T14:17:21 I use Gentoo you know... I compiled dozens of gcc releases :p 2011-07-15T14:17:47 i need a special version for http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/MSP430_LaunchPad_(MSP-EXP430G2) 2011-07-15T14:18:02 just to give you a clue: the rankings page shows the status from midnight 12/13th July 2011-07-15T14:18:12 sir_macelon: oh? 2011-07-15T14:18:43 check flags rating: http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/profile_games.php?user=7&page=2 2011-07-15T14:18:56 and mine: http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/profile_games.php?user=16&page=2 2011-07-15T14:18:56 well that's why: OperationalError: (1242, 'Subquery returns more than 1 row') 2011-07-15T14:19:03 amstan: is that a board with microcontroller and usb host? 2011-07-15T14:19:15 or is it an usb client only? 2011-07-15T14:19:22 mleise: nah.. the usb is just for programming 2011-07-15T14:19:27 you can check other 9 players also, but I am pretty sure somthing has happened then 2011-07-15T14:19:27 it's a poor man's arduino 2011-07-15T14:19:30 $4.30 2011-07-15T14:19:35 sir_macelon: restarted worker/manager 2011-07-15T14:20:34 yeah it is really cheap :). I used a simple LPT connected LCD once. It was quite nice for some system stats 2011-07-15T14:20:38 amstan: it may as well break again, I've seen mcleo commiting some change where he changed to return 2 rows instead of one, don't know why 2011-07-15T14:21:00 sir_macelon: right now it's not saying anything 2011-07-15T14:21:02 just processing 2011-07-15T14:21:21 2011-07-15 22:21:10,073 - 32069 - INFO - Updating leaderboard and adding some sigma 2011-07-15T14:21:28 ok good luck with the ranking page i'm out for a while 2011-07-15T14:21:41 sir_macelon: now we wait for the page to load 2011-07-15T14:21:45 amstan: https://github.com/aichallenge/aichallenge/commit/6b00236f326557905eba8abc3e9da50804cd09f4 2011-07-15T14:22:07 line 179 in sql/2_generate_matchup.sql 2011-07-15T14:22:42 I am not sure where there should be the 'limit 2', but I don't know the background behind it 2011-07-15T14:22:55 sir_macelon: he might have changed the python in another commit 2011-07-15T14:22:56 maybe this is the problem 2011-07-15T14:23:03 i did a git pull too 2011-07-15T14:23:46 hmm 2011-07-15T14:23:50 maybe i should restart the server.. 2011-07-15T14:24:39 my guess is the ranking page problem has something to do with memcache getting jammed somehow 2011-07-15T14:24:40 amstan: dunno, do what you think is best 2011-07-15T14:24:57 the generate_matchup query shouldn't have anything to do with it 2011-07-15T14:25:13 janzert: i think the rankings died because the manager died 2011-07-15T14:25:14 <@amstan> well that's why: OperationalError: (1242, 'Subquery returns more than 1 row') 2011-07-15T14:25:16 so why amstan has found this error: 2011-07-15T14:25:28 that limit 1 to limit 2 change has to do with excluding players from the previous 2 games instead of just the last one 2011-07-15T14:26:04 janzert: okay then you should check where did that error came from 2011-07-15T14:26:07 amstan: that could be, the memcache was just a guess of mine that I haven't looked into at all 2011-07-15T14:26:25 as far as im concerned, im perfectly ok with not seeing my shitty bot 2011-07-15T14:26:27 seems to be written there in the logs 2011-07-15T14:26:47 sir_macelon: that error should be tracked down but the manager never even calls that matchup query 2011-07-15T14:26:55 that is done from php code 2011-07-15T14:27:27 just trying to stop amstan from going down a blind alley in tracking the error down 2011-07-15T14:27:30 janzert: as I said, I don't know the impl details, just guessing to help 2011-07-15T14:28:11 now.. how did mcleopold start a screen session as contest? sudo su contest then screen doesn't like me 2011-07-15T14:28:18 amstan: we need to figure out what to do about a contest email address 2011-07-15T14:28:19 is there a way to pass a screen session to another user or something? 2011-07-15T14:28:29 -S 2011-07-15T14:28:37 janzert: you have to ask jeff about that, i have no control over the emails 2011-07-15T14:28:40 seems the rankings page is back up 2011-07-15T14:28:46 mcstar: -S is just for naming, right? 2011-07-15T14:29:02 janzert: can't you use the same mail sending as for pw? 2011-07-15T14:29:05 ah yeah 2011-07-15T14:29:18 yo have to start it as that user 2011-07-15T14:29:26 sir_macelon: we had many problems with email sending in pw 2011-07-15T14:29:35 mcstar: i can't though, because i cannot login as contest unless i sudo su contest 2011-07-15T14:29:47 amstan: I was wondering about maybe starting a google group the admins could be subscribed to 2011-07-15T14:29:48 why is that not good? 2011-07-15T14:30:13 amstan: chmod your pts to go=rw before sudo su to contest 2011-07-15T14:30:32 janzert: is that safe? 2011-07-15T14:30:36 janzert: tell me about that, why? 2011-07-15T14:31:00 amstan: you later want to access contest's screen? is that it? 2011-07-15T14:31:04 amstan: depends on your definition of safe ;) 2011-07-15T14:31:04 *** MikeTheAnt2 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-07-15T14:31:06 as another user i mean 2011-07-15T14:31:28 it allows other users on the machine to hijack your console yes, but that is what you want screen to do in this case 2011-07-15T14:31:48 thx, for teaching me this :) 2011-07-15T14:32:10 specifically use who to find out your pts then "chmod go=rw /dev/pts/" 2011-07-15T14:32:54 *** AlliedEnvy has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2011-07-15T14:32:57 now there's no rankings at all... 2011-07-15T14:34:46 sir_macelon: yeah.. it's working on it.. i hope 2011-07-15T14:35:08 i get a bunch of ./manager.py:129: Warning: Truncated incorrect time value: '991:33:08' though 2011-07-15T14:35:14 it was available previously for a short time 2011-07-15T14:35:46 amstan: something strange is going on i guess 2011-07-15T14:36:20 sir_macelon: are you willing to be sacrificed to the AI gods? 2011-07-15T14:36:30 mcstar: ? 2011-07-15T14:36:47 mcstar: what do you mean? another joke? :) 2011-07-15T14:36:52 ah, sorry, i didnt know you arent religious 2011-07-15T14:37:18 i have joked less than five today, sorry 2011-07-15T14:37:18 mysql is dying.. 2011-07-15T14:37:27 oh 2011-07-15T14:37:29 there we go! http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/rankings.php 2011-07-15T14:37:32 @rankings 20 2011-07-15T14:37:43 amstan: Error: There was a problem accessing the interface to ai-contest.com 2011-07-15T14:38:00 doesnt load :( 2011-07-15T14:38:00 it's still slow.. but.. i got a list of 2 pages 2011-07-15T14:38:26 and mysql is dying again. lol.. 2011-07-15T14:38:28 4 cores 2011-07-15T14:38:53 everybody's hitting the rankings page :} 2011-07-15T14:39:00 mcstar: I am a bit relgious, or rather should be as my mother is a catehist :P 2011-07-15T14:39:05 it's down to 0 again 2011-07-15T14:39:28 yeah.. this is not acceptable 2011-07-15T14:39:34 sir_macelon: im not at all, but what is a catehist? 2011-07-15T14:39:38 every time i click rankings the server goes nuts, 2 100% processes 2011-07-15T14:39:51 mcstar: religion teacher 2011-07-15T14:40:07 i never heard that word before :) 2011-07-15T14:40:29 *** smellyhippy has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-07-15T14:40:55 amstan: why is it doing this now? it site was up for many weeks 2011-07-15T14:41:05 mcstar: rankings were always slow 2011-07-15T14:41:05 mcstar: we have a very similar word for this in polish, maybe in hungarian it is different 2011-07-15T14:41:17 does it have to do with the more and more players participating? 2011-07-15T14:41:36 mcstar: of course.. 2011-07-15T14:41:56 20 people should have been enough for beta testing 2011-07-15T14:42:09 youve got a bit more lol 2011-07-15T14:42:25 also.. it's really killing the server to run the worker 2011-07-15T14:42:30 janzert: do we have a solution for that? 2011-07-15T14:42:31 The last two columns look to me like they may require a query/queries over the whole table of games. 2011-07-15T14:42:45 don't run the worker on the server? 2011-07-15T14:42:55 janzert: they have to run somewhere.. 2011-07-15T14:43:01 on worker servers 2011-07-15T14:43:03 amstan: maybe you could close some accounts that haven't been accessed for a longer time? 2011-07-15T14:43:08 yes, but they're always off 2011-07-15T14:43:15 janzert: could i manager them or something? 2011-07-15T14:43:38 ? they've been up without any downtime at all for almost if not all week 2011-07-15T14:43:47 janzert: oh.. ok 2011-07-15T14:43:56 amstan: yeah, you do have access through the ai-contest.com server 2011-07-15T14:44:13 but if they go down, i don't have any way to get their ips, right? 2011-07-15T14:44:19 sure you do 2011-07-15T14:44:50 weren't you saying that i have to go in the worker table and get their ip from there? 2011-07-15T14:45:07 *** smellyhippy has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:45:18 either through the beta server database (which won't tell you if the actual server is still running though) or through doing an ec2-describe-instances command on ai-contest.com 2011-07-15T14:45:55 the former is probably slightly easier to do, but doesn't tell you if ec2 took the servers down of course 2011-07-15T14:46:02 *** AlliedEnvy has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:46:48 ok, i see 2 instances 2011-07-15T14:47:24 janzert: you were also saying something about they keys.. 2011-07-15T14:47:29 that i had the old keys or something 2011-07-15T14:48:25 the correct ssh key is at /home/contest/workerkey on ai-contest.com 2011-07-15T14:49:37 to run ec2 commands against jeff's account in order to control or query the worker instances, su to contest then cd /home/contest/ec2-check and run ./ec2-env.sh 2011-07-15T14:49:46 janzert: so this should work? ssh -i workerkey ec2-72-44-43-134.compute-1.amazonaws.com 2011-07-15T14:49:59 i still get Permission denied (publickey). 2011-07-15T14:51:36 ssh -i workerkey ubuntu@72.44.43.134 2011-07-15T14:51:38 *** smellyhippy has quit IRC (Changing host) 2011-07-15T14:51:38 *** smellyhippy has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:51:53 right.. forgot the user 2011-07-15T14:51:53 i.e. add the ubuntu username 2011-07-15T14:52:37 is it supposed to take this long to ssh? 2011-07-15T14:52:41 oh, nvm 2011-07-15T14:52:48 got it, probably just reverse dns looking 2011-07-15T14:52:59 something's really eating cpu 2011-07-15T14:53:04 or was until just a second ago 2011-07-15T14:53:09 nope, it's all 0 2011-07-15T14:53:20 wasn't until a second ago ;) 2011-07-15T14:53:32 janzert: keep in mind that i did reboot the server 20 min ago 2011-07-15T14:53:50 ok, yeah looks like the workers died with that 2011-07-15T14:54:25 why does the manager just quit on exception? same with the worker 2011-07-15T14:54:29 they should continue doing stuff 2011-07-15T14:54:43 janzert: anyway.. in case the worker process dies, how do i restart it? 2011-07-15T14:54:47 McLeopold changed that a few weeks ago and it is a major pain 2011-07-15T14:55:24 create a contest user screen session and run worker -t -n 0 2011-07-15T14:56:54 janzert: wasn't there supposed to be a screen already running? 2011-07-15T14:57:00 *** _flag <_flag!~flag@69-165-173-172.dsl.teksavvy.com> has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T14:57:03 a fresh instance will run the worker script directly so there won't be a screen 2011-07-15T14:57:14 I have been thinking about changing that 2011-07-15T14:57:26 yes, that would be helpful 2011-07-15T14:57:42 also a thing in bashrc for the ubuntu user to automatically attach to that screen 2011-07-15T14:58:02 I don't think I'd want that 2011-07-15T14:58:24 janzert: how about running a screen as ubuntu, then sudo su to contest inside it 2011-07-15T14:58:33 it'll save us the trouble of chmodding ptys 2011-07-15T14:59:15 well the startup scripts run as the contest user 2011-07-15T14:59:33 no.. i mean till then 2011-07-15T14:59:50 ? 2011-07-15T15:00:23 till you make the change where the startup script makes a screen... when we need to start the screen manually we just start it as ubuntu, then sudo su contest inside it 2011-07-15T15:00:38 I mean the scripts that run at server boot to start everything else, the installation runs as root and the boot scripts run as contest 2011-07-15T15:00:48 ahh 2011-07-15T15:01:10 we could, it shouldn't really matter 2011-07-15T15:01:26 feel free to do it that way 2011-07-15T15:01:32 janzert: just saying.. if you have to login, just screen -r on ububuntu 2011-07-15T15:01:40 ubuntu* 2011-07-15T15:01:56 yeah, it's simpler I suppose :) 2011-07-15T15:03:25 k.. started the other workers 2011-07-15T15:05:00 anyway I've been getting ready to implement the confirmation emails, but I need a valid from address to send through amazon. I could just use my own email for now during beta, but what do you think of creating a google groups list for admins only to use for it (this could also be used as a contact email on the web page). 2011-07-15T15:05:16 heh, I think we've got two worker scripts running on both servers now 2011-07-15T15:05:44 janzert: you sure? they were both 0%ing when i logged in 2011-07-15T15:06:01 look at htop 2011-07-15T15:06:17 or ps -Af | grep worker 2011-07-15T15:06:31 ps -Af | grep screen too 2011-07-15T15:06:36 which one? .23? 2011-07-15T15:07:12 err, ps -Af | grep SCREEN 2011-07-15T15:07:19 which on what? 2011-07-15T15:07:23 one even 2011-07-15T15:07:41 i'm on ip-10-218-37-61 2011-07-15T15:07:50 there's 2 SCREENs 2011-07-15T15:07:52 both worker instances 2011-07-15T15:07:57 one's as contest, i think i forgot to remove that one 2011-07-15T15:08:01 right the contest one I started 2011-07-15T15:08:10 the ubuntu one you started :) 2011-07-15T15:08:15 I'll go ahead and kill mine 2011-07-15T15:09:23 hmm, I think you just killed yours as well 2011-07-15T15:09:32 nope, i have it open now 2011-07-15T15:09:36 at least on the one worker 2011-07-15T15:10:08 janzert: you might want to disable the reverse dns lookup for the ssh 2011-07-15T15:10:12 it makes ssh logins very very slow 2011-07-15T15:10:53 meh, shouldn't be logging in much anyway ;) 2011-07-15T15:11:54 actually it doesn't usually take long to login, I'm not really sure why it was so slow just now 2011-07-15T15:12:02 it is always slow for me 2011-07-15T15:12:05 like 10 seconds or more 2011-07-15T15:12:16 hmm, weird 2011-07-15T15:12:25 i had the same issue with ubuntu at work 2011-07-15T15:12:25 i do this on all my hosts 2011-07-15T15:12:31 certainly generally under 5 for me 2011-07-15T15:12:38 i dont remember that it would solve it though 2011-07-15T15:12:45 the only reason the dns lookup is enabled is for the auth log 2011-07-15T15:12:55 mcstar: http://www.yaleman.org/2007/12/09/ssh-reverse-dns-lookup-disable/ 2011-07-15T15:13:16 i kind of remember that i changed sshd.conf, but it didnt solve it 2011-07-15T15:13:35 amstan: yep, and I rather like having the audit trail 2011-07-15T15:13:56 UseDNS no, ok i didnt change this maybe, thx :) 2011-07-15T15:13:57 k 2011-07-15T15:14:27 but if it's too much of a pain for you, I'm not that opposed to changing it either 2011-07-15T15:15:43 anyway any thoughts on the admin mailing list to use for a contest contact email? 2011-07-15T15:16:17 janzert: we already have google apps for your domain, we can make a pseudo address there that forwards stuff to all of us 2011-07-15T15:17:32 that might work fine, the only advantage of an actual list I was thinking of was that when someone replied they could "reply to all" and then everyone else could see that a response had been sent 2011-07-15T15:17:52 it works the same as a list 2011-07-15T15:18:09 and it'll have a @ai-contest.com prefix 2011-07-15T15:18:12 without the archives though I imagine? 2011-07-15T15:18:21 yes, without the archives 2011-07-15T15:18:28 but we already have our inboxes for that 2011-07-15T15:18:40 we could of course use an @ai-contest.com email and have it forward to an actual list as well 2011-07-15T15:19:00 so long as you don't throw 'em out, but sure 2011-07-15T15:19:36 idk.. most people that email are really stressed out about their bots/passwords/accounts 2011-07-15T15:19:47 idk if that kind of mails are worth archiving anyway 2011-07-15T15:21:21 janzert: so.. what are you thinking? contact@ai-contest.com? 2011-07-15T15:21:59 or admin@ai-contest.com were the two choices I had thought of 2011-07-15T15:23:04 haven't put much thought into it though ;) 2011-07-15T15:27:12 a better solution is a helpdesk: have somebody assigned to taking skype calls 2011-07-15T15:27:42 if you'll man it :P 2011-07-15T15:27:47 hehe 2011-07-15T15:27:58 we still need an email address though 2011-07-15T15:28:21 janzert: i pinged jeff about it, so it'll take a while 2011-07-15T15:28:30 amstan: sounds good 2011-07-15T15:57:35 *** iouri_ has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T15:57:39 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2011-07-15T16:11:01 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T16:23:58 mleise: well... i have to compile it again, lol 2011-07-15T16:24:14 mleise: it was not the right version.. there's another one that's patched better, lol 2011-07-15T16:26:20 aichallenge: janzert epsilon * r8961f51 / (5 files in 2 dirs): Start reworking email sending to use Amazon SES - http://bit.ly/rmlgyj 2011-07-15T16:26:20 aichallenge: janzert epsilon * rbe224eb / (website/process_registration.php website/register.php): Loosen restrictions on passwords allowed - http://bit.ly/nUjive 2011-07-15T16:26:33 *** Accoun has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-07-15T16:42:37 *** berak has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-07-15T16:51:35 *** mcstar has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5) 2011-07-15T16:59:03 wtf http://aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com/visualizer.php?game=87026&user=13 2011-07-15T16:59:13 how is it that that i lose this game? 2011-07-15T16:59:20 how come my score is lower the cyan's 2011-07-15T16:59:49 this scoring model seems broken 2011-07-15T17:12:56 bhasker_ that is great news for me, I don't see anything broken here, perfect exapmle for a rewarding win for fighting bot 2011-07-15T17:13:06 but it lost... 2011-07-15T17:13:09 he had 6 ants 2011-07-15T17:13:12 i had 99% of the map 2011-07-15T17:13:17 makes no sense? 2011-07-15T17:13:38 how can he win when he clearly lost 2011-07-15T17:13:41 that's another story, if you would have killed it, you'd get the bonus 2011-07-15T17:13:56 irrespective of the bonus 2011-07-15T17:14:01 with such a large differential 2011-07-15T17:14:05 i should have won 2011-07-15T17:14:22 i can agree if we were close then him winning makes sense 2011-07-15T17:14:24 well yes indeed, the cutoff should be based on scores not on ants 2011-07-15T17:14:33 i've already stated that many times 2011-07-15T17:15:01 as in the game should cutoff when the score difference remains stable? 2011-07-15T17:15:38 it should work just like for the ant counts now 2011-07-15T17:15:51 66% advantage over 150 turns 2011-07-15T17:16:02 that's my opinion 2011-07-15T17:17:56 aichallenge: janzert epsilon * r1e16bd6 / (4 files in 2 dirs): Get email confirmations working - http://bit.ly/mZlKBf 2011-07-15T17:18:48 bhasker_: but you should keep in mind, if game turn limit would be around 500, you wouldn't have won anyway 2011-07-15T17:19:29 that is not the point here though right? we are talking about the current game limit 2011-07-15T17:19:45 if/when we fix to a certain turn number one can optimize for that limit 2011-07-15T17:20:22 i can conversely argue that if it was maybe 1600 i would have eventually wiped him out 2011-07-15T17:20:23 and won 2011-07-15T17:23:05 not a point, but a side note 2011-07-15T17:23:22 but you are right, you should have won that game 2011-07-15T17:23:40 the cutoff is not fair sometimes 2011-07-15T17:27:57 the problem is not the cutoff 2011-07-15T17:28:10 the problem is how we are scoring 2011-07-15T17:47:58 *** sir_macelon has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2011-07-15T17:50:35 *** iouri_ has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T17:54:03 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2011-07-15T17:54:15 *** mceier has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) 2011-07-15T17:59:57 contestbot: activation 2011-07-15T17:59:58 janzert: activation could be done by email later. but at the moment you have to click the 'click me' link (at the bottom) after completing the registration form instead. 2011-07-15T18:01:41 contestbot: activation 2011-07-15T18:01:41 janzert: activation could be (#1) done by email later. but at the moment you have to click the 'click me' link (at the bottom) after completing the registration form instead, or (#2) is now done by clicking on a link in a confirmation email. 2011-07-15T18:02:17 contestbot: activation 2011-07-15T18:02:18 janzert: activation could be is now done by clicking on a link in a confirmation email. 2011-07-15T18:03:11 contestbot: activation 2011-07-15T18:03:12 janzert: activation could be done now by clicking on a link in a confirmation email. 2011-07-15T18:14:12 *** sir_macelon has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T18:15:25 bhasker_: I don't think the scoring is wrong, why do you think so? Only the cutoff is wrong in my opinion 2011-07-15T18:33:33 *** choas has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2011-07-15T19:00:11 *** Kingpin13 has quit IRC (Quit: this used to be the life, but I don't need another one) 2011-07-15T19:06:38 *** Palmik has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2011-07-15T19:07:03 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T19:30:26 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T19:31:33 *** Palmik has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2011-07-15T19:38:49 contestbot's 'could be' is a challenge :p 2011-07-15T19:39:11 *** mleise has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2011-07-15T19:42:56 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2011-07-15T19:48:44 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T19:56:33 *** jmreardon has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2011-07-15T20:04:27 *** jmreardon has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T20:18:39 *** sir_macelon has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2011-07-15T20:26:30 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T20:43:23 *** Accoun has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2011-07-15T20:43:28 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T20:51:12 *** argyle has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T20:52:31 *** argyle has left #aichallenge 2011-07-15T20:54:23 personally i kind of agree. the scoring is shit 2011-07-15T20:56:43 i think we should have ant hills. you start with a hill, which has an ant on it, then as you eat more food ants spawn at your hill (one at a time, as you move ants off of it). we wouldn't even have to change the bot I/O protocol. you can just assume that your first ant marks the location of the hill and that eating food queues up ants to spawn from your hill 2011-07-15T20:57:10 this differs from the earlier ants game with hills in that you don't have to actually take food back to your hill (which i think slows things down too much) 2011-07-15T20:57:33 and of course also that combat is completely different (no hp, etc.) 2011-07-15T20:57:48 this would replace the scoring entirely. if you lose your hill, you lose 2011-07-15T20:58:10 hmm 2011-07-15T20:58:26 the protocol might need to be changed slightly to tell you where opponents' hill are, i guess 2011-07-15T20:58:35 *hills 2011-07-15T21:00:24 the effect of this would be that expansion would initially be much slower (aside from sending out scouts i guess), yet there would be a tradeoff between defending your hill and getting more ants. then there would be some fairly big clusters of ants and some big fights, and then whoever managed the defense/offense/expansion balance best would win 2011-07-15T21:30:57 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T21:30:57 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2011-07-15T22:11:44 jmcarthur: I rather like that game better than what we have; and scoring is purely by order of getting your hill taken over I assume? 2011-07-15T22:11:51 *** Mathnerd314 has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T22:11:59 I'm not so sure about making such a major change at this stage though 2011-07-15T22:29:46 *** onensora has quit IRC () 2011-07-15T22:39:16 i agree with janzert 2011-07-15T22:39:29 i much prefer it, but i'm not sure about changing it, no change in protocol is good though 2011-07-15T22:40:26 i would consider still having a scoring system like now, but giving people big points if they take out one players base, like wipe that players ants off the map and give the invading bot the number of points as the enemy bot had ants or whatever (plus say 20 for the base?) 2011-07-15T23:06:26 i think i'd rather make a major change, even now 2011-07-15T23:06:54 i'm not really happy with the game as it is :\ 2011-07-15T23:07:32 but i'm not rushing to volunteer to make such a change, so i guess i don't really have much say it it, deservedly 2011-07-15T23:07:57 *** sigh has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2011-07-15T23:08:37 *** fbparis has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T23:11:32 *** sigh has joined #aichallenge 2011-07-15T23:20:13 yeah, we're stretched pretty thin on people left with time to do things and willing 2011-07-15T23:26:30 one big advantage to me of going to hill capture would be getting rid of all indirect scoring, without that it's rather less appealing 2011-07-15T23:32:49 so we would just score it based on the order of people being removed from the game? 2011-07-15T23:33:02 would you take out a bots ants if their base is invade, or just stop them from spawning more ants? 2011-07-15T23:33:19 remove them from the game 2011-07-15T23:33:38 i think it would make the game much more interesting 2011-07-15T23:34:09 spawning would need to be able to "back up" for when people collected more than one food item per turn 2011-07-15T23:34:50 would ant hills block movement from friend ants? and would enemy ants invade by killing it like another ant or successfully residing on the ant hill after battle resolution? 2011-07-15T23:35:03 right, jmcarthur said that in his first message on it ;) 2011-07-15T23:35:24 I would say they don't block movement 2011-07-15T23:35:58 I was thinking just having an enemy ant occupy the hill square at the end of a turn is what kills it 2011-07-15T23:36:32 yep i agree 2011-07-15T23:36:33 it would require an addition to the protocol in case you missed that earlier 2011-07-15T23:36:59 what specifically? 2011-07-15T23:37:07 a few minor things like scores would disappear 2011-07-15T23:37:18 the engine would have to tell the bot about it when a hill first came into view 2011-07-15T23:37:25 ah yes 2011-07-15T23:37:51 i don't think adding/removing is so much a problem as changing the current protocol 2011-07-15T23:37:53 the biggest changes required though are probably to the visualizer :( 2011-07-15T23:38:07 provided the bots that are currently written only need minor adjustments i think it could be somewhat feasible 2011-07-15T23:38:28 the protocol change is minor enough that I don't have a problem with it 2011-07-15T23:38:39 i don't think it would be too much work for frontier to add an ant hill type thing on each location? 2011-07-15T23:38:50 he would need to agree of course 2011-07-15T23:38:56 just trying to think of what he'd need to do 2011-07-15T23:39:01 well, the whole goal of the game changes so the current bots will need to change a lot more than just the way they handle the protocol 2011-07-15T23:39:18 all the scoring stuff needs to go away in the visualizer 2011-07-15T23:39:27 ah yeah 2011-07-15T23:39:34 hmmmm 2011-07-15T23:40:03 so strip the score bar, keep #ants, and add visualisation of ant hills? 2011-07-15T23:40:25 I think changing the actual protocol parsing is extremely minor compared to changing the strategies, spawning behavior, etc 2011-07-15T23:40:27 i will see what he thinks later, i wouldn't be surprised if he (understandably) doesn't want to 2011-07-15T23:41:13 i would get my future cop lapd feature back :D 2011-07-15T23:41:51 one advantage of making such a major change in the game play at this stage is people can't complain so much about beta testers getting such an advantage ;) 2011-07-15T23:43:21 yep 2011-07-15T23:43:32 and it adds some spice to the people who have already been working on it 2011-07-15T23:43:59 i think i'm for it if mcleopold and frontier are 2011-07-15T23:44:37 i 2011-07-15T23:45:02 i'd be a little worried about people's ability to get to the base if a bot decides to just occupy the closest squares to it's base with the current battle option? 2011-07-15T23:45:43 with a more goal oriented game i think we might be able to get away with less flooded maps though? but yeah, i'm just speculating now