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2011-09-22T00:20:19  <janzert> contestbot: later tell McLeopold current games, maps and uploads are copied to new server. we can use rsync to copy any new ones over as well
2011-09-22T00:20:19  <contestbot> janzert: Yes master!
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2011-09-22T00:37:44  <McLeopold> amstan: can we get an A record for beta.ai-contest.com?
2011-09-22T00:37:57  <amstan> McLeopold: i don't have dns access
2011-09-22T00:38:17  <McLeopold> can you text jeff for dns access?
2011-09-22T00:38:41  <amstan> i think an email would work better, last time i din't get a reply
2011-09-22T00:38:56  <amstan> what i could do is redirect aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com
2011-09-22T00:39:17  <janzert> don't do that yet :}
2011-09-22T00:39:20  <McLeopold> no, we can all create new names
2011-09-22T00:39:34  <janzert> but I think we should once everything is moved over
2011-09-22T00:39:35  <McLeopold> I want to launch, and that means official dns records
2011-09-22T00:39:46  <janzert> yes, eventually
2011-09-22T00:39:57  <McLeopold> eventually as in within 48 hours
2011-09-22T00:40:10  <janzert> you want to launch in 48 hours?
2011-09-22T00:40:15  <McLeopold> beta, yes
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2011-09-22T00:40:38  <McLeopold> or at least get the server running with the right dns record
2011-09-22T00:40:55  <janzert> we can do final beta without changing dns
2011-09-22T00:41:11  <McLeopold> ai-contest.com?
2011-09-22T00:42:13  <janzert> what we do need to find out from jeff is that money is available
2011-09-22T00:42:15  <McLeopold> we had talked about a pw.ai-contest.com as well, so people can still look at the old site
2011-09-22T00:43:08  <janzert> after all my finagling today I'm rather convinced the main server shouldn't be a spot instance, which is fine but raises the cost to more than I'm willing to spend on the contest :/
2011-09-22T00:44:29  <janzert> McLeopold: can you move the database...err...data over?
2011-09-22T00:44:50  <janzert> I think everything else is setup
2011-09-22T00:45:25  <McLeopold> ok
2011-09-22T00:45:47  <janzert> I can shut down the current workers whenever you want to stop games being processed
2011-09-22T00:46:07  <McLeopold> yeah, shut them down now
2011-09-22T00:46:18  <janzert> and I suppose we should shut off submissions as well
2011-09-22T00:47:53  <janzert> hmm, out of curiosity does turning off submissions stop new user account creation?
2011-09-22T00:49:14  <janzert> workers are down
2011-09-22T00:49:35  <McLeopold> ok, give me 5 min
2011-09-22T00:52:34  <janzert> amstan: want the same username and ssh key from the current beta server setup?
2011-09-22T00:52:50  <amstan> sure
2011-09-22T00:53:12  <amstan> what about the pass? i still need it for root
2011-09-22T00:53:43  <janzert> I'm setting up all accounts iwth a disabled password and just ssh access
2011-09-22T00:53:50  <amstan> ok
2011-09-22T00:54:50  <McLeopold> we need to get jeff back on IRC for the next 2 weeks
2011-09-22T00:54:59  <McLeopold> then he can go awol again
2011-09-22T00:56:39  <janzert> amstan: your account should be setup
2011-09-22T00:57:20  <amstan> janzert: what was the hostname?
2011-09-22T00:57:23  <McLeopold> okay, data is moved, but do we run workers on both systems?
2011-09-22T00:57:30  <janzert> antsbeta.janzert.com
2011-09-22T00:57:41  <McLeopold> it seems like we should stick with one
2011-09-22T00:57:51  <janzert> I'll switch the workers to run against the new one
2011-09-22T00:57:57  <amstan> janzert: i get permission denied
2011-09-22T00:58:00  <McLeopold> so, do we point everyone there?
2011-09-22T00:58:10  <janzert> hmm, username alex right?
2011-09-22T00:58:14  <amstan> janzert: ya
2011-09-22T00:58:37  <janzert> McLeopold: I'd rather just change the aichallengebeta.hypertriangle.com dns once we're setup there
2011-09-22T00:58:52  <janzert> amstan: just sec, know the problem
2011-09-22T00:58:57  <McLeopold> 128.6 games in the last 5 minutes, wow
2011-09-22T00:59:06  <amstan> McLeopold: much better compared to 20
2011-09-22T00:59:14  <McLeopold> that can't be right
2011-09-22T00:59:21  <janzert> amstan: try now
2011-09-22T00:59:29  <amstan> yay
2011-09-22T00:59:46  <amstan> what's with the funky hostname?
2011-09-22T00:59:50  <janzert> wrong ownership of .ssh directory
2011-09-22T01:00:04  <janzert> it's the ec2 internal name
2011-09-22T01:00:44  <amstan> janzert: so how do i sudo? won't i need a pass for that?
2011-09-22T01:00:59  <janzert> rsync'ed last games and entries over
2011-09-22T01:01:05  <janzert> nope
2011-09-22T01:01:23  <janzert> you shouldn't have on the other beta server either
2011-09-22T01:01:24  <amstan> janzert: well, it asks for one
2011-09-22T01:01:27  <janzert> at least I didn't
2011-09-22T01:01:36  <janzert> ahh, oops forgot to add you to admin group
2011-09-22T01:01:51  <janzert> might need to relog for it to take effect
2011-09-22T01:02:14  <amstan> janzert: ok, cool
2011-09-22T01:02:22  <amstan> janzert: can we get the awesome bashrc for the contest user?
2011-09-22T01:02:37  <janzert> think I already got the imporant bits
2011-09-22T01:02:49  <janzert> if I missed something feel free to add it
2011-09-22T01:02:50  <amstan> oh yeah, good stuff
2011-09-22T01:02:53  <McLeopold> read the problem description page carefully...
2011-09-22T01:02:58  <amstan> though, coloured prompt is always nice
2011-09-22T01:03:25  <janzert> McLeopold: hmm any ideas?
2011-09-22T01:03:30  <janzert> mleise: you around?
2011-09-22T01:03:31  <amstan> contestbot: seen CIA-24
2011-09-22T01:03:31  <contestbot> amstan: CIA-24 was last seen in #aichallenge 4 hours, 5 minutes, and 42 seconds ago: <CIA-24> aichallenge: janzert epsilon * r2e7219d / worker/sandbox.py : Try harder and check better that the sandbox processes have died before leaving kill method - http://git.io/yU5AbA
2011-09-22T01:04:36  <McLeopold> I need a pass to sudo
2011-09-22T01:04:42  <amstan> McLeopold: hold on
2011-09-22T01:05:06  <janzert> heh, did I forget everyone's admin group :}
2011-09-22T01:05:10  <amstan> McLeopold: relogin
2011-09-22T01:06:25  <McLeopold> hold off on the website/setup.py for a few days
2011-09-22T01:06:40  <amstan> janzert: what about the sudo pass then? won't it be less secure than usual if there's no pass?
2011-09-22T01:06:48  <McLeopold> okay, I'm signing off for the night, any last requests?
2011-09-22T01:06:49  <amstan> (ignoring what i did with aichallengebeta)
2011-09-22T01:07:58  <janzert> it's sort of a trade off, there's no password on the system to attack, someone has to get ahold of an ssh key instead
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2011-09-22T01:08:54  <janzert> McLeopold: workers are good to start?
2011-09-22T01:09:04  <McLeopold> yep
2011-09-22T01:09:35  <janzert> ok, anything else you can think of that I missed setting up or bringing over?
2011-09-22T01:10:09  <McLeopold> not until it breaks :)
2011-09-22T01:10:20  <janzert> so long as everything appears good tomorrow we should probably let demerzel know he can have his server back
2011-09-22T01:10:32  <McLeopold> this server is much faster
2011-09-22T01:11:03  <janzert> and as soon as I see that the workers appear to be working I think you can switch the dns over if you like amstan
2011-09-22T01:12:07  <amstan> janzert: can we leave it for tomorrow? i want to go to bed soon, and i don't want to leave immediatelly after i do that
2011-09-22T01:12:29  <janzert> woot, we had just passed 200000 games on demerzel's server
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2011-09-22T01:20:24  <amstan> janzert: nice server, 8GB
2011-09-22T01:20:27  <amstan> of rams
2011-09-22T01:22:59  <janzert> yeah, ec2 has some nice specs
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2011-09-22T03:33:02  <Blkt> good morning everyone
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2011-09-22T06:57:23  <_flag> ~65
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2011-09-22T08:16:18  <mcstar> :q
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2011-09-22T11:58:59  <mcstar> i missed it by 9
2011-09-22T11:59:11  <mcstar> we didnt celebrate the 200000th game
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2011-09-22T12:00:44  <mcstar> the winner is svenhelge from sweden
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2011-09-22T12:01:53  <Blkt> good evening everyone
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2011-09-22T12:09:18  <janzert> contestbot: later tell mleise let me know what account name you would like on the new server and if I should take the ssh key from the old beta server
2011-09-22T12:09:18  <contestbot> janzert: Ready to serve, my lord.
2011-09-22T12:13:02  <mcstar> janzert: probably he would like to use unicode characters in it
2011-09-22T12:15:52  <CIA-24> aichallenge: James Whitehead II epsilon * r7e4c737 / ants/dist/starter_bots/go/ants.go : Update Go starter package for go.r60 - http://git.io/fM-mKA
2011-09-22T12:15:52  <CIA-24> aichallenge: James Whitehead II epsilon * rfae4a79 / ants/dist/starter_bots/go/ants.go : player_seed is a 64-bit value - http://git.io/DVY-mQ
2011-09-22T12:15:53  <CIA-24> aichallenge: Janzert epsilon * reaac016 / ants/dist/starter_bots/go/ants.go :
2011-09-22T12:15:53  <CIA-24> aichallenge: Merge pull request #256 from jnwhiteh/epsilon
2011-09-22T12:15:53  <CIA-24> aichallenge: Update Go starter package for go.r60 - http://git.io/hHPPow
2011-09-22T12:16:22  <jnwhiteh> thanks for the merge
2011-09-22T12:16:25  <janzert> jnwhiteh: thanks for the updates
2011-09-22T12:16:29  <jnwhiteh> np
2011-09-22T12:16:53  <jnwhiteh> too bad I have so much other work to do, I'd enjoy spending more time working on a bot =)
2011-09-22T12:18:23  <janzert> yeah, that work thing keeps getting in the way of all the good stuff ;)
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2011-09-22T12:24:30  <mleise> janzert: I should not have access to the real server.
2011-09-22T12:24:33  <janzert> mleise: looks like your update of the D language a few days ago broke the current D bots
2011-09-22T12:24:59  <janzert> mleise: ok, this isn't qute the real server yet
2011-09-22T12:24:59  <mleise> janzert: on aichallengebeta ?
2011-09-22T12:25:29  <mleise> janzert: ok, then on the new server I'd like my home directory to be copied :)
2011-09-22T12:25:56  <mleise> I would chose mleise as the login name, but frontier is fine
2011-09-22T12:25:57  <janzert> mleise: well the workers run against antsbeta.janzert.com now but I believe it just happens to be the first time the workers completely resetup since that checkin
2011-09-22T12:26:34  <janzert> I didn't see your worker_setup.py change slip in with the rest of that commit :P
2011-09-22T12:27:07  <mleise> I updated the D package, yes. that's what I wanted to ask
2011-09-22T12:27:26  <mleise> "how can I update a programming language package on the server"
2011-09-22T12:27:31  <janzert> since it's just you and one other and we're in beta I don't think it's a problem just that you need to update your bot so it doesn't have an error
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2011-09-22T12:27:45  <janzert> pretty much by starting new workers
2011-09-22T12:28:26  <mleise> so the package doesn't have to be installed into some secret chroot environment? ok
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2011-09-22T12:29:07  <janzert> it gets installed in the chroot environment by worker_setup.py
2011-09-22T12:29:57  <janzert> the actual method it uses is after setting up the base chroot, worker_setup.py is run inside the new chroot to install the languages
2011-09-22T12:31:12  <janzert> you account named mleise should be all set
2011-09-22T12:32:05  <mleise> thx
2011-09-22T12:36:14  <janzert> contestbot: later tell amstan Could you contact demerzel and let him know he can have his server back
2011-09-22T12:36:14  <contestbot> janzert: OK
2011-09-22T12:36:29  <amstan> contestbot: seen demerzel
2011-09-22T12:36:29  <contestbot> amstan: demerzel was last seen in #aichallenge 5 weeks, 4 days, 23 hours, 29 minutes, and 49 seconds ago: <demerzel> workk crazy
2011-09-22T12:36:50  <amstan> janzert: that means i can also forward the domain over?
2011-09-22T12:36:54  <amstan> to antsbeta.janzert.com
2011-09-22T12:36:58  <janzert> I was hoping you had an email address
2011-09-22T12:37:11  <janzert> yes, or just point it at the ip
2011-09-22T12:37:44  <janzert> 107.20.156.231
2011-09-22T12:39:29  <amstan> janzert: should be up
2011-09-22T12:40:13  <amstan> janzert: yep, i'm getting the key error
2011-09-22T12:40:24  <janzert> wow only a 2 minute TTL
2011-09-22T12:40:32  <janzert> the key error?
2011-09-22T12:40:38  <amstan> janzert: yeah, i like having those on my domains since i have dynamic ip
2011-09-22T12:40:47  <janzert> ahh, from ssh because the host changed
2011-09-22T12:40:49  <amstan> key error because it's another server now
2011-09-22T12:40:50  <amstan> yes
2011-09-22T12:41:55  <amstan> janzert: k, so all good?
2011-09-22T12:41:57  <amstan> can i go?
2011-09-22T12:42:26  <janzert> seems like
2011-09-22T12:42:31  <amstan> cool
2011-09-22T12:42:32  <amstan> cya
2011-09-22T12:42:41  <janzert> if you can just let demerzel know when you get a chance
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2011-09-22T12:48:04  <McLeopold1> @seen j3camero
2011-09-22T12:48:04  <contestbot> McLeopold1: j3camero was last seen in #aichallenge 13 weeks, 2 days, 13 hours, 48 minutes, and 1 second ago: <j3camero> Text me at 416 464 3096.
2011-09-22T12:48:25  <janzert> :/
2011-09-22T12:49:41  <McLeopold1> so, now what?
2011-09-22T12:50:44  <janzert> I think we go forward with the timing on final beta and just we'll have to move to the final server when Jeff comes around
2011-09-22T12:51:07  <janzert> then we'll go live after at least a couple days on the final server
2011-09-22T12:51:53  <janzert> I'm going to be gone until probably late this evening btw
2011-09-22T12:52:08  <antimatroid> amstan should be able to prod jeff once we're fully ready?
2011-09-22T12:52:31  <janzert> think he did
2011-09-22T12:52:35  <antimatroid> ahhh :\
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2011-09-22T12:52:45  <antimatroid> he did send an email recently i saw that
2011-09-22T12:59:13  <janzert> McLeopold1: slightly worriesome, the last two games of GreenTea ranked 1st had Cellular2 ranked 105th, played 50 minutes apart so it shouldn't have been a double scheduling problem
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2011-09-22T13:01:48  <JokerJo> Hi all. Whats wrong with bots upload? Who knows? Beta is over?
2011-09-22T13:02:18  <janzert> ah no we just moved to a different server
2011-09-22T13:02:30  <janzert> and forgot to turn it back on is all :)
2011-09-22T13:02:45  <McLeopold1> janzert: if you find a second case of a bad matchup, then let me know
2011-09-22T13:03:03  <janzert> JokerJo: should be back on now
2011-09-22T13:03:13  <janzert> McLeopold1: yep, yep
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2011-09-22T13:09:12  <McLeopold1> janzert: GreenTea's games look okay
2011-09-22T13:09:25  <McLeopold1> the mu drops to 60 fairly quickly
2011-09-22T13:09:43  <janzert> ok
2011-09-22T13:10:16  <McLeopold1> once he get's paired with someone at 65 or so, which is very likely, the match quality drops and we start pulling in someone that matches them both
2011-09-22T13:10:58  <McLeopold1> the deal is, even though he is the seed, the other players will also be put at the back of the line, so I have to match well against everyone in the game, not just the seed
2011-09-22T13:11:15  * janzert nods
2011-09-22T13:12:12  <janzert> I suppose pretty unavoidably the people at either end of the rankings will get a worse average match quality
2011-09-22T13:12:17  <McLeopold1> did you get map turn limit automatted yet?
2011-09-22T13:12:37  <janzert> running automatically, no
2011-09-22T13:12:52  <janzert> it'll just be a cron entry though
2011-09-22T13:13:05  <janzert> I'm still running it manually more than once a day right now ;)
2011-09-22T13:13:53  <janzert> none of the maps have topped out yet so I'm still not sure the current metric will really work out
2011-09-22T13:14:15  <McLeopold1> are they just increasing?
2011-09-22T13:14:32  <McLeopold1> 500 looked like a good limit...
2011-09-22T13:14:55  <janzert> so far every chance they get (i.e every time a map has hit 100 games at the current limit)
2011-09-22T13:15:09  <McLeopold1> maybe it was more like, 500 if the game ends, otherwise it goes for ever, and it might have been 50% / 50%
2011-09-22T13:15:54  <janzert> there's a few maps now with lower average game lengths but they haven't hit the 100 game mark yet
2011-09-22T13:16:15  <McLeopold1> how's my map distribution?
2011-09-22T13:16:18  <janzert> I'll try and make a script to spit out histograms soon
2011-09-22T13:16:30  <McLeopold1> I haven't tried to fix it yet
2011-09-22T13:16:38  <janzert> I haven't looked at it since earlier in the week
2011-09-22T13:16:53  <McLeopold1> I should probably put a time limit on it...
2011-09-22T13:17:01  <McLeopold1> even out the maps for the last 72 or something
2011-09-22T13:17:26  <janzert> yeah, especially if we're going to add a new batch every 24 hours
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2011-09-22T13:19:55  <antimatroid> are my maps being used yet? :P
2011-09-22T13:21:01  <McLeopold1> antimatroid: so, did you need to fix anything in the map generator?  because you have a week to finalize...
2011-09-22T13:21:19  <antimatroid> McLeopold1: how are you using it?
2011-09-22T13:21:35  <antimatroid> are you still asking or for say a transationally symmetric map with n players?
2011-09-22T13:21:52  <antimatroid> that was the one major thing that was horrible to use
2011-09-22T13:22:21  <McLeopold1> what?
2011-09-22T13:22:41  <antimatroid> those maps i have that allow 5 player symmetric maps etc.
2011-09-22T13:22:53  <antimatroid> it's hard to be told how many players you want for such a map
2011-09-22T13:22:55  <McLeopold1> where it is just tiled?
2011-09-22T13:22:59  <antimatroid> yeah
2011-09-22T13:23:31  <McLeopold1> of course, we want everything we can get
2011-09-22T13:23:42  <antimatroid> if you have it set up to ping it a few times with a few different number of players it'll eventually spit something out
2011-09-22T13:23:43  <McLeopold1> but, we need to start producing good maps with more than one starting ant
2011-09-22T13:23:48  <antimatroid> but it had trouble with some numbers of players
2011-09-22T13:23:52  <antimatroid> i think 5 and 7 from memory
2011-09-22T13:24:01  <McLeopold1> was it random walk?
2011-09-22T13:24:01  <antimatroid> more than one starting ant?
2011-09-22T13:24:11  <antimatroid> it doesn't do that, but shouldn't be that hard to make it do it
2011-09-22T13:24:43  <antimatroid> it uses recursive backtracking to make a maze in a generating set of the symmetry of the maze
2011-09-22T13:24:49  <McLeopold1> idealy so that each starting spot is surrounded by a different set of enemy bots
2011-09-22T13:25:19  <antimatroid> then randomly removes some more blocks to open the map up a bit and then randomly removes single water cells from the edge of the map to make the walls not straight lines
2011-09-22T13:25:26  <McLeopold1> I guess I need to review the map makers...
2011-09-22T13:25:56  <McLeopold1> what about the symmetric maps that we use now?  we've still got one for that, right?
2011-09-22T13:26:43  <antimatroid> i haven't taken map generators off github
2011-09-22T13:26:49  <McLeopold1> ok
2011-09-22T13:26:51  <antimatroid> the maze generator is the mapgen.py one
2011-09-22T13:27:08  <antimatroid> and is set up to let you use parameters etc.
2011-09-22T13:28:29  <antimatroid> i think you'd be best off just working out what proportion of tiled/translational/tessellation maps you want with a minimum and maximum number of players rather than specific numbers of players
2011-09-22T13:28:47  <antimatroid> that is tiled == translational == tessellation
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2011-09-22T14:16:38  <mleise> janzert: So I guess the D starter bot is working with the compiler upgrade?
2011-09-22T14:17:42  <janzert> no idea really
2011-09-22T14:18:02  <janzert> the only two active D bots seem to have been you and ReaperUnreal
2011-09-22T14:18:10  <janzert> both of those stopped working
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2011-09-22T14:21:32  <janzert> I think your profile page should be showing you the error
2011-09-22T14:23:19  <janzert> looks like two string method deprecations and a template error in core.time.TickDuration.to()
2011-09-22T14:23:37  <mleise> the deprecations were expected
2011-09-22T14:23:55  <janzert> it looks like the deprecations are telling you to use the same method instead?
2011-09-22T14:25:46  <janzert> ahh, I see the method capitalization has changed
2011-09-22T14:26:07  <janzert> e.g. splitLines instead of splitlines
2011-09-22T14:27:14  <janzert> being that both of you have the same error I would guess that code is in the starterbot as well
2011-09-22T14:31:39  <mleise> looks, like that error depends on compile options. I don't get it in a debug build
2011-09-22T14:33:53  <janzert> ugh
2011-09-22T14:34:25  <janzert> the wonderful world of the dmd compiler
2011-09-22T14:38:24  <mleise> oh yes, and I really thought this upate fixed more than it broke. I even waited out the 2.054 release
2011-09-22T14:38:44  <mleise> One of the following flags must go: -inline -release -noboundscheck
2011-09-22T14:38:52  <mleise> wich one would you chose?
2011-09-22T14:39:39  <janzert> -inline I suppose
2011-09-22T14:41:11  <mleise> or let me try a downgrade
2011-09-22T14:41:26  <janzert> McLeopold1: I don't understand why the food cutoff didn't kick in for this game http://antsbeta.janzert.com/visualizer.php?game=201463
2011-09-22T14:42:57  <mcstar> :S what is happening on that map?
2011-09-22T14:43:19  <mcstar> why arent the ants moving?
2011-09-22T14:43:41  <janzert> basically starter bots I believe or at least close to it
2011-09-22T14:43:56  <janzert> they all get stuck on the walls or in the case of rabidus the origin :}
2011-09-22T14:44:16  <mcstar> i thought rabidus' bot was more advanced
2011-09-22T14:45:25  <mcstar> janzert: are the two sites the same? aichallangebeta.hypertriangle and this one?
2011-09-22T14:45:46  <janzert> yes, the dns was updated to point at the new server
2011-09-22T14:48:20  <CIA-24> aichallenge: Marco Leise epsilon * r6523ef7 / (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed D builds, by downgrading to 2.054 - http://git.io/Uz090w
2011-09-22T14:49:23  <mleise> janzert: You may trigger a new compile now.
2011-09-22T14:50:25  <janzert> worker's are reloading now
2011-09-22T14:50:42  <olexs> is the new server now on EC2?
2011-09-22T14:50:57  <janzert> yes
2011-09-22T14:51:07  <olexs> so we're now beta-testing the production environment
2011-09-22T14:51:18  <janzert> pretty much yes
2011-09-22T14:51:23  <mleise> ... oh does that reinstall the compiler?
2011-09-22T14:51:37  <janzert> mleise: yep
2011-09-22T14:51:43  <mleise> very cool
2011-09-22T14:51:47  <olexs> nice. good to see progress, after a long time of waiting :)
2011-09-22T14:51:50  <janzert> I'm not positive how to reactivate the submissions
2011-09-22T14:52:11  <janzert> I think the status just has to be reset, but I'm not sure
2011-09-22T14:52:20  <mleise> I guess by resetting some flag in the submissions list?
2011-09-22T14:52:33  <janzert> I'll give it a try after the workers come back up
2011-09-22T14:53:04  <mleise> ok, I'm off
2011-09-22T14:53:42  <janzert> heh, just noticed you're user_id 1
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2011-09-22T14:54:02  <mleise> the early bird catches the worm
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2011-09-22T14:55:47  <mcstar> that reminds me of Arthur Mitchell
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2011-09-22T14:59:51  <olexs> user data will be reset when the challenge starts, I hope? what with all the multiple and test accounts and loads of old starter bots still in there
2011-09-22T15:00:12  <janzert> yes
2011-09-22T15:00:42  <janzert> we're planning on a complete reset and start from scratch for a 'final' beta, probably this weekend
2011-09-22T15:00:51  <olexs> nice
2011-09-22T15:01:02  <olexs> "release candidate"? :)
2011-09-22T15:02:57  <mcstar> i suggest to start from a negative version number to leave room for improvement
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2011-09-22T15:19:59  <xathis> hey, what's up with the current matching algorithm? I'm #2 and out of my last 14 games only the most recent one included other top 10 bots.
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2011-09-22T15:30:38  <mcstar> xathis: your bot plays real nicely, good work
2011-09-22T15:31:50  <xathis> mcstar: thanks :)
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2011-09-22T15:45:28  <McLeopold1> xathis: If you think there is an issue, we need to look at it
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2011-09-22T15:46:59  <xathis> McLeopold1: I know the game count has to be kept even, but the new matching is frustrating i think
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2011-09-22T15:47:05  <McLeopold1> janzert: what was the minimum rank diff when choosing an opponent for planet wars?
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2011-09-22T15:47:22  <janzert> minimum? 0
2011-09-22T15:48:02  <McLeopold1> maybe I should lower it so 80% are within 30?
2011-09-22T15:48:03  <janzert> it was a straight pareto distribution excluding only the last 50 opponents
2011-09-22T15:48:43  <janzert> I was thinking it should probably be lower yeah, but 30 might be a little too tight
2011-09-22T15:48:56  <janzert> 80% within 80 right now?
2011-09-22T15:49:08  <McLeopold1> within 50, but that is for 2 players
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2011-09-22T15:49:45  <McLeopold1> http://wwwcsif.cs.ucdavis.edu/~kramer/papers/self_sim.pdf
2011-09-22T15:49:51  <McLeopold1> I'm using equation 3
2011-09-22T15:49:54  <janzert> ahh, yes and quite likely the second player may be the closest
2011-09-22T15:50:58  <janzert> yeah, 80% in 30 may be fine
2011-09-22T15:51:04  <McLeopold1> I'm going to tighten up the range, just to see
2011-09-22T15:51:44  <janzert> 80% in 20 is probably even ok
2011-09-22T15:52:23  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * re850845 / sql/2_generate_matchup.sql : tighten pareto dist - http://git.io/jhVHXw
2011-09-22T15:52:23  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * r3840e2e / (7 files in 6 dirs): Merge branch 'epsilon' of github.com:aichallenge/aichallenge into epsilon - http://git.io/gMRxuQ
2011-09-22T15:52:53  <janzert> looks like I used an alpha of 0.75 for planetwars putting 80% with 8
2011-09-22T15:53:01  <janzert> whithin
2011-09-22T15:53:18  <janzert> within even
2011-09-22T15:53:33  <janzert> that's was probably a little too tight though
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2011-09-22T15:53:43  <McLeopold1> 8? that is small
2011-09-22T15:54:48  <McLeopold1> I did my alpha at 0.7, to try and hit 1 in a 1000 uses the full range
2011-09-22T15:54:56  <McLeopold1> 0.75 was about 3 in 1000
2011-09-22T15:54:56  <janzert> I don't remember exactly how it was implemented so it might have been two tailed when ever in the middle of the rankings making it 16
2011-09-22T15:55:28  <McLeopold1> so, 80% within 16?
2011-09-22T15:56:50  <McLeopold1> xathis: your last match included GreenTea
2011-09-22T15:56:55  <janzert> possibly :), I'm just looking at the spreadsheet I used to pick alpha and don't remember if the implementation would have made this a two tailed distribution or not
2011-09-22T15:56:57  <McLeopold1> the one before that had a rank 3
2011-09-22T15:56:58  <McLeopold1> 30
2011-09-22T15:57:38  <_flag> Are the workers running?
2011-09-22T15:57:58  <janzert> no, they didn't come back up. looking at it now
2011-09-22T15:58:02  <xathis> McLeopold1: yeah but the last one was before you changed anything.
2011-09-22T15:58:31  <xathis> McLeopold1: but the 13 games before the last one were without another top 10 bot
2011-09-22T15:58:31  <McLeopold1> and it included #1
2011-09-22T16:00:13  <janzert> xathis: how frequently do you think is reasonable for you to have played a top 10?
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2011-09-22T16:00:56  <janzert> remembering that we had a problem with planetwars where the top bots played each other too frequently and turned out not to be so good against the rest of the field in some cases
2011-09-22T16:01:33  <xathis> with the old matching i think there was hardly any game without another top 10 bot and i liked that
2011-09-22T16:02:26  <McLeopold1> maybe 50% within 10?
2011-09-22T16:03:09  <janzert> I don't think I'd want it any more frequent
2011-09-22T16:03:47  <janzert> although it's something I could be easily convinced otherwise ;)
2011-09-22T16:06:07  <McLeopold1> he got alot around the 15-35 range
2011-09-22T16:06:19  <janzert> McLeopold1: did you see my question about the food cutoff above?
2011-09-22T16:06:27  <McLeopold1> yeah, no idea
2011-09-22T16:06:41  <McLeopold1> they all looked like starter bots, so it might be easy to reproduce
2011-09-22T16:07:00  <janzert> also to re-enable a submission that was disabled because it didn't compile for a game, do I just set the status back to 40?
2011-09-22T16:07:08  <janzert> ok
2011-09-22T16:07:16  <McLeopold1> yes
2011-09-22T16:12:21  <janzert> hmm, no idea why the workers didn't come up properly. they seem to be working fine when I ran the setup manually
2011-09-22T16:14:24  <delt0r> gota love the modern era... "it worked the other 100 times?"
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2011-09-22T16:19:18  <olexs> there are currently two workers used in the beta. I hope the started challenge will use more / more powerful ones? It will obviously need a higher game rate than the beta.
2011-09-22T16:20:12  <McLeopold1> olexs: the workers are the exact machine we'd use for the official and finals
2011-09-22T16:20:19  <McLeopold1> the number of workers depends on money
2011-09-22T16:20:38  <mcstar> but time is money
2011-09-22T16:20:42  <mcstar> this is a loop
2011-09-22T16:20:45  <olexs> how much do they cost to run?
2011-09-22T16:21:03  <McLeopold1> 20 cents an hour?
2011-09-22T16:21:39  <mcstar> McLeopold1: where are those ideas standing regarding advertising?
2011-09-22T16:21:44  <olexs> so ~300$ per worker for the 2 months
2011-09-22T16:22:01  <McLeopold1> about
2011-09-22T16:22:31  <mcstar> are you keeping the google in the name at all?
2011-09-22T16:22:35  <McLeopold1> mcstar: well, I've never done adwords before
2011-09-22T16:22:46  <McLeopold1> we'd need a volunteer to make it look nice
2011-09-22T16:23:04  <McLeopold1> that is j3camero decision
2011-09-22T16:23:08  <delt0r> google is pretty fast to claim illegal clicks and cut you off
2011-09-22T16:23:24  <olexs> google in the name is what brought most people to planetwars, no doubt
2011-09-22T16:23:26  <McLeopold1> I didn't say click fraud, geez
2011-09-22T16:23:39  <McLeopold1> yeah, it brought me :)
2011-09-22T16:23:48  <delt0r> neither did i
2011-09-22T16:23:52  <delt0r> that is the point
2011-09-22T16:24:08  <delt0r> This has happened to a lot of people i know
2011-09-22T16:24:14  <delt0r> you can't depend on it
2011-09-22T16:24:19  <McLeopold1> hmm...
2011-09-22T16:24:21  <mcstar> delt0r: ads in blogs?
2011-09-22T16:24:25  <mcstar> or what?
2011-09-22T16:24:26  <delt0r> No
2011-09-22T16:24:27  <McLeopold1> j3camero: could sell his own
2011-09-22T16:24:32  <delt0r> forums etc
2011-09-22T16:24:43  <delt0r> like java-gaming.org
2011-09-22T16:24:46  <McLeopold1> 300$ for a small graphic on the front page for the duration of the contest
2011-09-22T16:25:20  <delt0r> wouldn't a uni somewhere what to support this? I know i get more than that to run a course or two
2011-09-22T16:25:23  <cody__> pay per view would mint a lot of money with all the refreshing..
2011-09-22T16:25:24  <mcstar> well, when i first heard of the contest i thought, whoa, sponsored by google, that must be big/awesome
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2011-09-22T16:25:47  <delt0r> mcstar: i think we all did
2011-09-22T16:25:57  <detryo> hi all
2011-09-22T16:26:02  <olexs> what exactly was the google participation, actually? :)
2011-09-22T16:26:10  <mcstar> i think that was it
2011-09-22T16:26:19  <mcstar> smell of candy
2011-09-22T16:26:29  <delt0r> as i understand --nothing other than permission to use the name
2011-09-22T16:26:39  <McLeopold1> yeah, that was it
2011-09-22T16:26:46  <olexs> underwhelming
2011-09-22T16:27:06  <mcstar> McLeopold1: so what about waterloo uni?
2011-09-22T16:27:17  <McLeopold1> I've got no connections there, as amstan
2011-09-22T16:27:21  <McLeopold1> ask
2011-09-22T16:27:30  <mcstar> (maybe i am misremembering this, but i think i read its related to the uni)
2011-09-22T16:27:32  <amstan> bit abynire euther
2011-09-22T16:27:39  <amstan> not anymore either*
2011-09-22T16:27:44  <amstan> it was connected to uwaterloo
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2011-09-22T16:29:20  <mcstar> of course my idea to pay a fee per registration was kind of a joke, i guess it would be a big deal to implement some kind of paying system
2011-09-22T16:29:30  <mcstar> but you could accept paypal donations
2011-09-22T16:29:38  <mcstar> how about putting it on the main site?
2011-09-22T16:29:47  <olexs> it might be a bit late for ants, but what about kickstarter?
2011-09-22T16:29:50  <McLeopold1> a donation link wouldn't be too bad
2011-09-22T16:29:54  <mcstar> yes
2011-09-22T16:30:11  <delt0r> once you take money... you need to think of taxes and company registration
2011-09-22T16:30:17  <delt0r> at least in most countries
2011-09-22T16:30:29  <mcstar> its not-for-profit
2011-09-22T16:30:43  <delt0r> you need to register and qualify for that
2011-09-22T16:30:50  <delt0r> it is not a given
2011-09-22T16:30:50  <mcstar> :S
2011-09-22T16:30:57  <mcstar> i hate money
2011-09-22T16:31:36  <delt0r> It not a huge deal... but it more or less mean you need a "official" legal standing
2011-09-22T16:31:45  <delt0r> somewhere... it can just be a club etc
2011-09-22T16:32:10  <cody__> create a stock market bot..
2011-09-22T16:32:19  <delt0r> I am now in Bio--so i can't really get money for a CS comp
2011-09-22T16:32:43  <mcstar> if i put my paypal account up on a site and say: if you pant to donate then do, in some countries that would be illegal?
2011-09-22T16:32:52  <mcstar> does it depend on where the site is hosted?
2011-09-22T16:32:56  <mcstar> its very grey to me
2011-09-22T16:33:19  <mcstar> pant->want
2011-09-22T16:34:08  <McLeopold1> not illegal, just counts as income
2011-09-22T16:34:42  <delt0r> yep.. and then you pay income tax
2011-09-22T16:34:51  <delt0r> again not a biggie
2011-09-22T16:34:58  <delt0r> but something to consider
2011-09-22T16:35:35  <delt0r> also others can't claim it as a donation to a Charity or non profit or whatever
2011-09-22T16:36:47  <mcstar> then lets just hope jeff will be succesful, and will use his jedi skills
2011-09-22T16:51:41  <cody__> cant somone just donate server time?
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2011-09-22T16:53:22  <delt0r> it is not just the server... but the internet connection... but yes. for a uni this should be pretty easy and very cheap since its more or less covered with overheads
2011-09-22T16:53:48  <delt0r> but then IT departs are toss pots
2011-09-22T16:54:10  <delt0r> "you can't have port 22 open. its insecure!
2011-09-22T16:56:45  <cody__> how many worker serververs needed per 1000 players?
2011-09-22T16:57:35  <delt0r> how many workers so that the non of the 1000 players complain?
2011-09-22T16:58:11  <cody__> so whats the number..
2011-09-22T16:58:12  <McLeopold1> it's the game rate
2011-09-22T16:58:21  <McLeopold1> how often do you want a game?
2011-09-22T16:59:26  <cody__> as ofen as posible..
2011-09-22T16:59:39  <olexs> well, then you need as many workers as possible
2011-09-22T16:59:55  <delt0r> which was my point
2011-09-22T17:00:40  <delt0r> technically even with few workers the final outcome just takes longer...
2011-09-22T17:01:26  <delt0r> but while folks are tweaking their bots and what instant feedback on how well it worked. As many as possible ends up being the answer
2011-09-22T17:03:33  <cody__> current game reate is 10.1 players per minute... right
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2011-09-22T17:04:04  <olexs> btw, I'm not sure that display is very correct
2011-09-22T17:04:47  <olexs> I've often waited for my next game watching that info, and it always took a lot longer than the displayed ETA.
2011-09-22T17:06:38  <McLeopold1> yeah, it is flawed
2011-09-22T17:06:42  <McLeopold1> because we don't really know
2011-09-22T17:07:22  <mcstar> McLeopold1: than how about, after launch, you help someone make a good tcp server?
2011-09-22T17:07:35  <mcstar> (im not asking you to do it, just asking about the possibility)
2011-09-22T17:07:36  <McLeopold1> geeze, I'm busy enough
2011-09-22T17:07:40  <mcstar> sure
2011-09-22T17:07:56  <McLeopold1> I'll host a tcp server, but I'm not going to make one
2011-09-22T17:08:25  <delt0r> I want to do it
2011-09-22T17:08:26  <mcstar> than delt0r might save the day
2011-09-22T17:08:31  <delt0r> lol
2011-09-22T17:08:38  <olexs> I've heard a few times in this channel about there being some code for such a server already, but never any details
2011-09-22T17:08:41  <delt0r> but its a matter of finding the time
2011-09-22T17:09:03  <delt0r> and on the odd occasion... the soberness. :D
2011-09-22T17:09:39  <delt0r> My engine is more or less finished... that i would tie into my own server frame work
2011-09-22T17:09:56  <delt0r> the question is --how to interact with the http server
2011-09-22T17:10:06  <delt0r> via a DB
2011-09-22T17:10:12  <delt0r> or via something else
2011-09-22T17:10:16  <mcstar> im not sure than wheather we should give delt0r free beer
2011-09-22T17:10:29  <delt0r> oh i have free beer
2011-09-22T17:10:44  <olexs> why not use the same engine the challenge uses, and just redirect the in/out streams through a tcp connection using a connection manager tool?
2011-09-22T17:10:48  <delt0r> I am going to be at oktoberfest on wenday too
2011-09-22T17:10:53  <mcstar> than lets take it away from you so you will find that elusive soberness
2011-09-22T17:10:55  <delt0r> wensday
2011-09-22T17:10:55  <mcstar> :D
2011-09-22T17:11:07  <delt0r> olexs: that is less fun
2011-09-22T17:11:20  <olexs> delt0r: i see :)
2011-09-22T17:11:33  <delt0r> seriously... I wrote my own ECC stuff for my game...
2011-09-22T17:11:36  <delt0r> because it was fun
2011-09-22T17:11:54  <delt0r> but yea... still however does not change much
2011-09-22T17:12:10  <delt0r> its been many days... but not a lot of time.
2011-09-22T17:12:24  <delt0r> I just don't get to do much outside work atm
2011-09-22T17:12:25  <mcstar> still dont know what ecc is
2011-09-22T17:12:33  <mcstar> other than error correction
2011-09-22T17:12:40  <delt0r> ecliptic Curve Cryptography
2011-09-22T17:12:45  <mcstar> ah
2011-09-22T17:12:50  <mcstar> i remember you told me that
2011-09-22T17:13:05  <delt0r> did LDPC codes too
2011-09-22T17:13:15  <mcstar> you mean LAPD?
2011-09-22T17:13:20  <mcstar> haha
2011-09-22T17:14:07  <delt0r> that is where Bayesian learning prorogation was first applied... aka now used in true skill
2011-09-22T17:14:29  <delt0r> Low Density Parity Codes
2011-09-22T17:14:29  <mcstar> your keyboard is seriously dislexic
2011-09-22T17:14:34  <delt0r> that me
2011-09-22T17:14:38  <delt0r> that is me
2011-09-22T17:14:40  <delt0r> hehe
2011-09-22T17:14:55  <delt0r> its a german keyboard with a US layout
2011-09-22T17:15:11  <mcstar> made in germany?
2011-09-22T17:15:11  <delt0r> which is different from both a german keyboard and a US one
2011-09-22T17:15:23  <delt0r> probably
2011-09-22T17:15:35  <delt0r> in Austria ... no one makes anything for Austria
2011-09-22T17:15:40  <mcstar> ah, it was made during ww2, so the germans only had bad photographs of the us layout, i see
2011-09-22T17:15:51  <delt0r> lol
2011-09-22T17:16:30  <delt0r> anyway... I have a bunch of 6+hour train rides coming up next week.. i hope to do some "turn key" tcp server
2011-09-22T17:16:57  <mcstar> you code on the ride?
2011-09-22T17:17:23  <delt0r> yea
2011-09-22T17:17:29  <delt0r> trains here are really nice
2011-09-22T17:17:37  <delt0r> most of my trains are the ICE
2011-09-22T17:17:47  <delt0r> they have power points etc
2011-09-22T17:17:58  <mcstar> lol
2011-09-22T17:18:03  <mcstar> microsoft?
2011-09-22T17:18:07  <delt0r> so yea can code... or what movies or whatever the whole way
2011-09-22T17:18:09  <delt0r> lol
2011-09-22T17:18:20  <delt0r> in NZ that is what we call a power socket
2011-09-22T17:19:08  <delt0r> anyway there is something i have always wanted to try... with regard to the tcp server
2011-09-22T17:19:11  <mcstar> id call it power outlet
2011-09-22T17:19:15  <mcstar> is that correct?
2011-09-22T17:19:25  <delt0r> I understand --that is enough
2011-09-22T17:19:46  <mcstar> lol, i remember when we went to swtzerland
2011-09-22T17:19:54  <mcstar> they have a socket that no other country has
2011-09-22T17:20:04  <mcstar> we werent prepared
2011-09-22T17:20:23  <mcstar> we had us plugs, but not swiss
2011-09-22T17:20:35  <mcstar> the last day of conference i could charge my powerbook
2011-09-22T17:20:37  <delt0r> it is almost the same as the rest of Europe ... but rather than 5mm pins, they use 4mm
2011-09-22T17:20:54  <mcstar> they have a central 3rd pin afaik
2011-09-22T17:21:02  <delt0r> not needed
2011-09-22T17:21:16  <mcstar> well, nevertheless we couldnt plug in ours
2011-09-22T17:21:23  <mcstar> i dont remember exactly the shape
2011-09-22T17:21:29  <delt0r> Swiss plugs work in the rest of Europe
2011-09-22T17:21:34  <delt0r> not the other way round
2011-09-22T17:22:06  <mcstar> anyway, last day i discovered that the cable that run to the TV in the hotel room, had an end, that resembled an "8"
2011-09-22T17:22:26  <mcstar> that i could plug in the apples adapter if i pulled out the pins
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2011-09-22T17:23:32  <mcstar> yes i remember now, i tried to jam the plug in the wall-socket
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2011-09-22T17:24:07  <delt0r> anyway... the thing  i was keen to try... is a "turn key app" that writes and updates a bunch of static html pages that some other webserver serves?
2011-09-22T17:24:25  <delt0r> whadayathink?
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2011-09-22T17:24:38  <mcstar> seems amstan started miosis
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2011-09-22T17:25:43  <mcstar> (if youre asking me delt0r i have no idea what you talkig about)
2011-09-22T17:27:16  <McLeopold1> delt0r_: that's how my planet wars pages were generated, all static html
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2011-09-22T17:28:21  <delt0r> how did you find it McLeopold1? would you do it again?
2011-09-22T17:29:46  <McLeopold1> find it?
2011-09-22T17:32:11  <delt0r> did it work out... would you do again --was it a good idea
2011-09-22T17:33:23  <delt0r> I am thinking that because html etc is white space agnostic, i can have quite big blocks of white space and update pages with random access file handles
2011-09-22T17:33:55  <cody__> dose anyone know when the contest is going to be launched..... is there lots of bugs? ... lots of work leftover?
2011-09-22T17:34:48  <delt0r> very soon
2011-09-22T17:35:47  <mcstar> leftover, bugs, launch, im getting hungry
2011-09-22T17:38:04  * delt0r gets more beer
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2011-09-22T18:01:13  <McLeopold1> delt0r_: static html was a quick a dirty solution to the system having text files for the back end data
2011-09-22T18:02:14  <McLeopold1> It feels like a poor mans caching system
2011-09-22T18:02:52  <McLeopold1> I didn't have anything to clean up old filenames, the just got orphaned by a lack of links
2011-09-22T18:04:29  <McLeopold1> I don't think treating an html file as a random access database is a good idea
2011-09-22T18:05:22  <_flag> Is it just me does the matchmaking tend to be less skill-based now?
2011-09-22T18:05:37  <McLeopold1> _flag: very much so
2011-09-22T18:05:45  <_flag> Why?
2011-09-22T18:05:53  <McLeopold1> if it is skill based, we can't keep the game rates even
2011-09-22T18:06:28  <McLeopold1> but we did just turn down the range of players available as an opponent
2011-09-22T18:07:14  <McLeopold1> we are using a pareto distribution to give us a pool of players close to the seed, so 80% of the time, your first opponent will be within 30 ranks
2011-09-22T18:07:38  <McLeopold1> that may need to be tighted up some more
2011-09-22T18:08:13  <McLeopold1> and by 30 ranks, I mean the 30 closest players in match quality, which is kinda 30 ranks, but not exactly
2011-09-22T18:09:30  <_flag> What if you try to give precedence to players who haven't played recently? The game rate won't be consistent, but maybe it will even out?
2011-09-22T18:11:51  <McLeopold1> we do, but it is the second criteria
2011-09-22T18:12:19  <McLeopold1> the first is preference to players you haven't played yet, then it is total games in last 24 hours
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2011-09-22T18:12:51  <McLeopold1> so, the pool of players to choose from is limited by match quality, then the games counts are used
2011-09-22T18:13:34  <_flag> And if you limit it more top players don't play as often?
2011-09-22T18:13:57  <_flag> I think that's what I remember happening before
2011-09-22T18:14:04  <McLeopold1> well, the seed player is always whoever hasn't played in the longest time
2011-09-22T18:14:23  <McLeopold1> if I limit the pool size, then top players will player other top players more often
2011-09-22T18:15:05  <_flag> That's good right?
2011-09-22T18:15:18  <McLeopold1> mostly, we are trying to find the sweet spot
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2011-09-22T18:16:29  <McLeopold1> I'm checking your games
2011-09-22T18:18:01  <_flag> In the most recent one for example, the highest ranked player other than myself was 59th
2011-09-22T18:18:03  <McLeopold1> ok, you've had some crappy matchups...
2011-09-22T18:18:12  <McLeopold1> arg
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2011-09-22T18:26:42  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * rb72e121 / sql/opponent.sql : update to opponent debugging - http://git.io/xR230g
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2011-09-22T18:31:59  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * r341cae3 / sql/opponent.sql : update to opponent debugging - http://git.io/8QUekg
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2011-09-22T18:45:54  <McLeopold1> @later tell _flag my best guess right now is trueskill is using you to decipher the true skills of the other players by giving you a good match quality with everyone cause your so awesome
2011-09-22T18:45:54  <contestbot> McLeopold1: Job's done.
2011-09-22T18:46:30  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * r2d1483b / sql/match_quality.sql : add match_quality sp - http://git.io/px4PFg
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2011-09-22T18:53:44  <McLeopold1> I need a math guy: antimatroid? delt0r_?
2011-09-22T18:53:52  <McLeopold1> jmcarthur: ?
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2011-09-22T19:12:38  <antimatroid> McLeopold1: i'm here?
2011-09-22T19:13:47  <McLeopold1> antimatroid: I need a function that returns a number in the range of [0,1) with a pareto distribution where 0 is the least common and ~1 is the most common.
2011-09-22T19:15:17  <McLeopold1> I was using b / ( rand ^ (1 / a) ) but that generates number from b and larger
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2011-09-22T19:16:16  <antimatroid> McLeopold1: I'd ask Janzert?
2011-09-22T19:16:38  <antimatroid> you can usually change the distribution of rand though
2011-09-22T19:18:14  <antimatroid> http://docs.python.org/library/random.html that page has random.paretovariate(alpha)?
2011-09-22T19:19:35  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * rc1d0702 / (sql/match_quality.sql sql/opponent.sql): improvements to matchup debugging - http://git.io/SsH8aw
2011-09-22T19:22:37  <McLeopold1> in sql
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2011-09-22T19:46:12  <janzert> McLeopold1: isn't simply (rand ^ (1 / a) what you want? i.e if (1 / (rand ^ (1/a)) goes from one to infinity with 1 most common, then (1 / (1 / (rand ^ (1 / a)))) gives 1 to 0 and the two outside divisions just cancel out. (aside, technically to get the inclusive range with b in the original formula I think you have use b / ((1-rand) ^ (1 / a)) but it works out right for the [0, 1) range)
2011-09-22T19:46:49  <McLeopold1> doh
2011-09-22T19:47:14  <McLeopold1> yes, I think that would work
2011-09-22T19:47:25  <McLeopold1> janzert: I see more issues with the match maker
2011-09-22T19:47:44  <janzert> oh :( I hope you see fixes too ;)
2011-09-22T19:47:51  <McLeopold1> The pareto is working nicely, it's just not pulling in the closest 30 for some reason
2011-09-22T19:48:03  <janzert> hmm
2011-09-22T19:48:05  <McLeopold1> Some of it has to do with excluding players in a matchup
2011-09-22T19:48:19  <McLeopold1> but there are some pulled into the pool that don't make any sense
2011-09-22T19:53:54  <CIA-24> aichallenge: McLeopold epsilon * r87172c3 / (sql/match_quality.sql sql/opponent.sql): updates to matchup sql debugging - http://git.io/OdCflQ
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2011-09-22T20:43:11  <dr0b3rts> I think that p = 1 - (1 - rand) ^ (a / (a-1))  should give you the right distribution. If a = log 5 / log 4 = 1.16, then p is in [0,0.8] 20% of the time and in [0.8,1] 80% of the time.
2011-09-22T20:43:57  <dr0b3rts> See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_distribution#Pareto.2C_Lorenz.2C_and_Gini
2011-09-22T20:44:08  <dr0b3rts> And take the inverse of L(F)
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2011-09-22T22:42:08  <aurora> hey, i just downloaded the ruby starter package; how do I get started on running it?
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2011-09-22T23:46:45  <dr0b3rts> @later tell McLeopold p = 1 - (1 - rand) ^ (a / (a-1)) should give you the right distribution. For example, if a = log 5 / log 4 = 1.16, then p is in [0,0.8] 20% of the time and in [0.8,1) 80% of the time, and p in [0.99,1) 52.8% of the time. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_distribution#Pareto.2C_Lorenz.2C_and_Gini\
2011-09-22T23:46:45  <contestbot> dr0b3rts: Error: Missing "]".  You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
2011-09-22T23:47:25  <dr0b3rts> @later tell McLeopold "p = 1 - (1 - rand) ^ (a / (a-1)) should give you the right distribution. For example, if a = log 5 / log 4 = 1.16, then p is in [0,0.8] 20% of the time and in [0.8,1) 80% of the time, and p in [0.99,1) 52.8% of the time. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_distribution#Pareto.2C_Lorenz.2C_and_Gini"
2011-09-22T23:47:25  <contestbot> dr0b3rts: Yes master!
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