2012-04-24T00:15:33 *** chris__0076 has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T00:18:49 *** Chris_0076 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2012-04-24T00:20:37 *** chris__0076 is now known as chris_0076 2012-04-24T00:32:29 *** dvladim has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2012-04-24T00:37:54 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T00:50:35 *** chris__0076 has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T00:54:06 *** chris_0076 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2012-04-24T01:06:08 *** Areks has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T01:24:12 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2012-04-24T01:24:53 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T01:36:06 *** chris__0076 is now known as chris_0076 2012-04-24T02:14:10 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2012-04-24T02:20:48 *** thestinger has quit IRC (Quit: sleep) 2012-04-24T02:45:58 *** replore has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2012-04-24T02:58:49 *** chris_0076 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T02:59:15 *** Chris_0076 has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T03:07:08 *** pairofdice has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T03:43:42 *** kurnevsky has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T03:51:08 *** kurnevsky has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T03:55:03 *** noord has quit IRC (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 11.0/20120312181643]) 2012-04-24T04:48:31 *** GeorgeH has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2012-04-24T04:57:39 *** GeorgeH has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T05:22:32 2 weeks from implementation to launch? evidence tells us otherwise :) 2012-04-24T05:24:12 A game is quickly implemented, but it needs to be tested and tuned. How-tos want to be written, tools created, starter bots and so on 2012-04-24T05:44:41 *** Cyndre_ has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T05:54:34 *** Cyndre has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2012-04-24T05:54:34 *** welterde has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2012-04-24T05:57:28 *** Areks has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2012-04-24T06:11:14 *** welterde has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T06:12:21 *** Areks has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T06:49:24 *** delt0r_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2012-04-24T06:56:33 *** kurnevsky has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T07:01:44 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T07:13:34 *** foRei has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T08:08:19 *** Jak_o_Shadows has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T08:27:53 *** Jak_o_Shadows has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2012-04-24T08:56:02 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T08:56:05 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:06:41 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:06:42 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2012-04-24T09:16:36 *** mceier has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:29:37 *** HaraKiri has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:30:00 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2012-04-24T09:32:16 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:46:08 i agree with mleise, 2 weeks simply isn't enough 2012-04-24T09:46:42 in contests prior to ants things changed after launch and others changes which would have been nice couldn't happen etc. 2012-04-24T09:52:35 *** noord has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T09:52:50 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:52:54 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T09:57:55 *** noord has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T10:03:38 *** mcstar has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:03:57 it doesnt matter how much time is spent on developing the game 2012-04-24T10:03:59 Ants wasn't really straight forward, but I think we reiterated on that just enough times to make it good. 2012-04-24T10:04:10 what matters is ppl to not know what it is going to be 2012-04-24T10:04:34 hmm... yeah those beta testers had a good head start *g* 2012-04-24T10:05:03 for example, it is very easy to build an asteroids engine, and sy with time on his hand can develop a bot right away 2012-04-24T10:05:44 so the organizers should discuss the next game with a limited group, and exclude them from the contest 2012-04-24T10:07:14 mleise: the best strippers are dressed in pinstripe suits.... 2012-04-24T10:10:05 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:10:09 *** noord has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:10:16 *** noord has left #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:10:42 yeah watever 2012-04-24T10:11:17 XD 2012-04-24T10:11:32 im just wondering, maybe your friend tried to cheer you up... 2012-04-24T10:11:39 thanks for looking up that word though ;) 2012-04-24T10:11:54 It wasn't a friend, just some random dude :p 2012-04-24T10:12:00 ah 2012-04-24T10:26:31 really, people are getting upset over the 2 week period? i would think they would get upset over the ammount of time we're taking 2012-04-24T10:26:43 antimatroid, mleise ^ 2012-04-24T10:28:14 (i think they would get upset if bugs are left in the game, since 2 weeks arent enough to shake them out) 2012-04-24T10:28:43 what mcstar said. 2012-04-24T10:29:08 *** Palmik has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:29:13 well.. it's not set in stone 2012-04-24T10:29:14 Even ants had rough edges and people said something along the lines of "I would have expected better quality from Google" 2012-04-24T10:29:33 well.. the expectations were a bit high 2012-04-24T10:29:57 we are not Google, have no QA department and so on 2012-04-24T10:30:27 *** Areks has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2012-04-24T10:30:51 amstan: my point is that a game is quickly implemented. it may be done in a single day. all the work around that is taking time. 2012-04-24T10:30:53 amstan: what about my suggestion of doing it privately?(though that would rule out asteroids pretty much) 2012-04-24T10:32:04 it sounds to me like you are planning to do everything in 2 weeks, besides the bit of game implementation that's actually the fastest to do 2012-04-24T10:32:41 I'm thinking of the Planet Wars server code for example. That were maybe 2 screen pages of code. 2012-04-24T10:32:45 mcstar: we could still do asteroids, but we'll probably make our own thing, so i hope it'll be different enough 2012-04-24T10:33:26 the only thing i want to avoid is having the game done before the rest of the framework 2012-04-24T10:33:37 last time we started with ants first, then we worried about the framework 2012-04-24T10:33:55 so all the time that we were working on the framework, people got a chance to play ants 2012-04-24T10:34:27 amstan: hehe, I'm sure it will include 'drifting' objects and maybe homing missiles and a "fixed frame rate". with these assumptions you can write a month worth of collision detection and other code 2012-04-24T10:34:33 mcstar: i'm not sure how private will work 2012-04-24T10:34:42 mleise: point 2012-04-24T10:35:35 ok, so how can the framework be finalized when the game is not there? 2012-04-24T10:35:52 we'll just implement a dummy game 2012-04-24T10:35:58 like who picks the highest number 2012-04-24T10:35:59 starter bots? 2012-04-24T10:36:09 how-tos? 2012-04-24T10:36:16 website design? 2012-04-24T10:36:18 no, just something for trueskill i guess 2012-04-24T10:36:25 maybe a PRNG 2012-04-24T10:36:29 starter bots are not a problem if they come after launch 2012-04-24T10:36:29 XD 2012-04-24T10:36:34 how tos the same 2012-04-24T10:36:57 website design, we can do that fairly quickly as well 2012-04-24T10:37:19 ok, you are in charge :) 2012-04-24T10:37:22 mcstar: yeah, exactly, we just need bots in like 3 languages to test trueskill and the compilation pipeline 2012-04-24T10:37:32 mleise: aarossig did the last design in about a day 2012-04-24T10:38:08 I spend weeks discussing the interface and file formats for Ants with McLeopold :p 2012-04-24T10:38:39 hey... btw. I forgot one thing: who writes the visualizer _after_ release? 2012-04-24T10:38:53 *** g0llum has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:39:00 last contests we had that happen as well 2012-04-24T10:39:14 mleise: what else would you propose, i agree with you 2012-04-24T10:39:19 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2012-04-24T10:39:31 we should have a lot of this stuff beforehand, but that means we offer an unfair advantage to some people 2012-04-24T10:39:58 that's right and why mcstar proposed a private development phase 2012-04-24T10:40:26 but how would that work? all the code is open source 2012-04-24T10:40:42 and that would mean not allowing anyone in the private circle to compete 2012-04-24T10:40:49 i didn't consider that ^^ 2012-04-24T10:40:59 i said that exactly, and i think it is reasonable 2012-04-24T10:41:09 you *could* host the code on a private server for that time 2012-04-24T10:41:27 we could even do private github actually 2012-04-24T10:41:38 hmm 2012-04-24T10:41:44 sure, just a matter of what is cheaper/easier 2012-04-24T10:41:51 it's $7/month 2012-04-24T10:42:18 e.g. aichallenge.org isn't doing much at the moment 2012-04-24T10:42:41 it is like planting potatoes in one year and wheat in another 2012-04-24T10:42:49 o.O 2012-04-24T10:42:57 my allegories suck, i know :p 2012-04-24T10:43:07 lol 2012-04-24T10:43:59 all i wanted to say is, if the server is running anyway, it can be used for a git repository in between games 2012-04-24T10:44:20 sure, but that means no wiki or issues 2012-04-24T10:44:32 on a sidenote, it would be interesting to choose the asteroids game, maybe this could be the first time, that some machine learning alg. or similar thing could actually win 2012-04-24T10:45:31 amstan: but, you think this is a viable solution in general? (the private development phase and exclusion from participation) 2012-04-24T10:45:40 i'm not sure 2012-04-24T10:45:55 we need to have a meeting sometime and decide all of this 2012-04-24T10:47:15 you could consider other similar contests to 2012-04-24T10:47:17 o 2012-04-24T10:47:26 what do they do? release early, before the launch? 2012-04-24T10:47:50 or they dont leak at all? 2012-04-24T10:48:00 (i think the latter, but it is a guess) 2012-04-24T10:52:50 i for the first time just read mcstar's name as McStar 2012-04-24T10:52:54 rather than mc-star 2012-04-24T10:52:56 like mc-hammer 2012-04-24T10:53:03 mind blown 2012-04-24T10:53:15 which is it meant to be? 2012-04-24T10:53:23 what a revelation 2012-04-24T10:53:30 antimatroid: like this: mcstar 2012-04-24T10:53:42 oh, you cant hear me 2012-04-24T10:53:48 WHAT? 2012-04-24T10:54:05 emseestar 2012-04-24T10:54:13 i think you will find few volunteers to help with exclusion from competing 2012-04-24T10:54:21 It would be great if the framework count's actual cpu cycles opposed to what was done with the ants, those timeouts where quite annoying altought the servers where doing fine :) 2012-04-24T10:54:30 hkraal: it's too hard 2012-04-24T10:54:40 we've wanted to and looked into it in the past 2012-04-24T10:54:48 and always concluded it'd too hard cross-platform and cross-language 2012-04-24T10:54:52 it's* 2012-04-24T10:55:21 amstan: GitHub's issue tracking isn't very sophisticated. A Google search brought up this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantis_Bug_Tracker With a plugin it integrates with both git and GitHub. Maybe if someone is familiar with any of those bug trackers it would be quickly set up. 2012-04-24T10:55:49 where? 2012-04-24T10:55:52 i do like the idea of giving bots a buffer per game 2012-04-24T10:56:02 like you can use up to 2 seconds in total from going over 2012-04-24T10:56:35 antimatroid: that works? it sounds neat 2012-04-24T10:56:55 what works? 2012-04-24T10:57:01 a buffer? there's no reason why it wouldn't 2012-04-24T10:57:04 your time buffer idea 2012-04-24T10:57:20 it's been mentioned in the past not by me 2012-04-24T10:57:33 and when you use up less time you get back buffer time, till the 2 secs are full again 2012-04-24T10:58:01 *** Ryan___ has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T10:58:13 or just add up remaining time each turn, for full utilization in any turn 2012-04-24T10:58:37 (and send the bot the total available time each turn) 2012-04-24T10:59:27 that could stretch the game quite a bit, if there is alway just one bot using more than the others 2012-04-24T10:59:27 anyway, a bot timing out is bot not worth having 2012-04-24T10:59:39 *** Ryan___ has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2012-04-24T11:00:34 antimatroid: an-tee or an-tie? 2012-04-24T11:01:44 mcstar: the problem was in the virtualisation layer. The time you had for your turn was moving forward even no cpu cycles where used. This is known as ready time (the time that the VM spends waiting on a cpu cycle to become available) 2012-04-24T11:02:29 for wall time vs cpu time both must be used 2012-04-24T11:02:35 you can't just use cpu time 2012-04-24T11:02:41 or else one can just sleep(100000) 2012-04-24T11:03:01 antimatroid: if you would spin off a bot in his own thread you can use the OS information from your main thread to calulate its real usage if I'm not mistaken? 2012-04-24T11:04:04 if i recall correctly, the winner used java, and that runs on a vm i heard 2012-04-24T11:04:11 amstan: very true :) 2012-04-24T11:04:26 * antimatroid knows almost nothing about how computors actually work 2012-04-24T11:04:30 including languages etc. 2012-04-24T11:04:38 i just pass it instructions :) 2012-04-24T11:04:53 if ppl massively time out, the organizers can always just raise the timelimit 2012-04-24T11:05:06 there's limitations there 2012-04-24T11:05:08 but that didnt happen, some ppl timed out only 2012-04-24T11:05:08 resource wise 2012-04-24T11:05:51 Well short version: VM requests CPU cycles from its host. If the host has none the VM just has to wait (= Ready time), meanwhile the time does move forward but its not equally fast as the cpu 2012-04-24T11:06:53 why wouldnt it get cpu time? (with a default nice level) 2012-04-24T11:07:09 * mcstar not a vm expert or anything 2012-04-24T11:07:33 because the schedular of the virtualisation technology used some cycles for its own or has trouble finding a real CPU to put your thread on 2012-04-24T11:08:26 how often does this happen? 2012-04-24T11:08:33 what is te resolution of this scheduling? 2012-04-24T11:08:38 but the fact that there are none cpu cycles availible doesn't mean time doesn't go forward :) 2012-04-24T11:09:49 so if you limit a turn to 1s. In theory you could get anywhere between 0 and max cpu cycles :) 2012-04-24T11:10:01 in theory i dont care 2012-04-24T11:10:07 what about in practice? 2012-04-24T11:11:22 it would be more average. With the ants I knew I had 500 ms calculation time. So after each ant I checked how much time was left, if it was < 100 ms I would stop calculating 2012-04-24T11:12:09 but if at 101ms remaining there is no CPU cycle availible for 102ms? then my bot would instantly time out 2012-04-24T11:12:23 *for the duration of 102 ms 2012-04-24T11:12:58 But it isn't a fair limit since I couldn't do anything in those 102ms because I had no cpu cycles left.. 2012-04-24T11:13:26 im quite sceptical about that the vm cant schedule some work on the system for 100ms 2012-04-24T11:13:31 thats a huge lag 2012-04-24T11:13:47 mcstar: is very normal with VMware 2012-04-24T11:13:57 vmware? 2012-04-24T11:14:01 wait 2012-04-24T11:14:08 ? 2012-04-24T11:14:27 we were taling about virtual machines, executing some bytecode, not an os virtualization 2012-04-24T11:14:30 talking* 2012-04-24T11:15:31 so? why are you talking about vmware? 2012-04-24T11:16:11 Because thats where (a part of) the servers where running on with the Ants challenge 2012-04-24T11:16:27 where? 2012-04-24T11:16:48 The company I work for sponsored them 2012-04-24T11:18:02 where -> were 2012-04-24T11:18:05 pls 2012-04-24T11:19:28 Ah like that. When the Ants started the hardware wasn't in production yet, it is now so those boxed can't be used without impact :) 2012-04-24T11:20:15 or did you just made a comment on my spelling? Me is getting confused :+ 2012-04-24T11:20:21 yes 2012-04-24T11:20:54 ah srry :) 2012-04-24T11:22:55 hkraal: but if you were talking about os virtualization, than that affects all languages equally 2012-04-24T11:24:09 It does, but that doesn't make time alone a good measurer :) 2012-04-24T11:25:18 just use the VM's cpu time as real time 2012-04-24T11:25:28 (but i guess you have no access to that) 2012-04-24T11:27:42 You can't trust the CPU time, that's just my point :) 2012-04-24T11:28:36 hkraal: cpu time of the VM process on the physical machine 2012-04-24T11:28:54 That would be a hard one yeah :) 2012-04-24T11:29:55 It would be possible with lower virtualisation techniques (OpenVZ/Virtuozzo) but not others like VMware 2012-04-24T11:30:40 But Linux has it's tools to measure real CPU time, but the bot must have it's own process ID to be able to measure it 2012-04-24T11:35:38 i don't think my bot timed out once during ants comp 2012-04-24T11:35:41 and i'm kind of timeouts 2012-04-24T11:35:59 i was pretty happy aboot that 2012-04-24T11:38:15 hehe :) 2012-04-24T11:38:27 Well, time to close the day 0/ 2012-04-24T11:55:13 OpenVZ has the issue, that it takes away the layer of virtual memory 2012-04-24T11:55:41 A Java process that would use 1GB virtual and 20MB physical is suddenly just using 1GB memory 2012-04-24T11:56:22 It's really messy with all the software today that is written to use lots of virtual memory 2012-04-24T11:57:30 The first Ants beta ran on an OpenVZ system and we had trouble spawning two Java bots simultaneously without running out of memory ... lol 2012-04-24T11:58:46 of course we were able to remedy the situation a bit by passing flags to the JVM, but it wasn't a good solution 2012-04-24T12:00:12 *** pairofdice has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2012-04-24T12:05:08 *** dici has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T12:07:40 *** pairofdice has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T12:23:00 *** j3camero has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2012-04-24T12:23:04 *** j3camero has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T12:31:05 storm 2012-04-24T12:33:31 *** Chris_0076 has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2012-04-24T12:37:21 *** mviel_ has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2012-04-24T12:56:02 *** kilae has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T13:07:54 *** Accoun has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T13:08:50 jealous 2012-04-24T13:08:53 i love storms 2012-04-24T13:09:44 so? 2012-04-24T13:09:51 antimatroid: will you answer me? 2012-04-24T13:10:53 what? 2012-04-24T13:11:02 sorry have been trying to do an assignment :P 2012-04-24T13:11:18 i asked b4, an-tee or an-tie? 2012-04-24T13:11:37 i say an-tee 2012-04-24T13:11:41 like anti hero 2012-04-24T13:12:13 i believe everywhere you can saz antee can say antie too 2012-04-24T13:12:26 it is just a preference 2012-04-24T13:12:31 am i wrong? 2012-04-24T13:14:24 antimatroid: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/antimatroid?s=t 2012-04-24T13:14:40 dunno 2012-04-24T13:14:41 dear, intimated... 2012-04-24T13:14:45 XD 2012-04-24T13:15:09 (i know, the 2 pronounciations of anti seem to be interchangeable) 2012-04-24T13:16:46 oops, pronunciation 2012-04-24T13:18:17 im stuupid 2012-04-24T13:18:38 im trying to resize a messagebox, but in fact im doing it on a non visible widget 2012-04-24T13:18:52 ^^^ thats what you get for dense code 2012-04-24T13:21:52 *** dvladim has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T13:30:31 what's a sequence of sets of real numbers whose union is the set of real numbers but each set only has a finite number of rational numbers? 2012-04-24T13:34:17 * pairofdice hides from what looks like math 2012-04-24T13:35:19 that is easy 2012-04-24T13:36:09 i imagine you can imagine fixed precision numbers with increasing precision 2012-04-24T13:37:30 well, you have to cover the whole number line somehow, but each set has to have finite number of rationals, hm 2012-04-24T13:37:53 antimatroid: what is your question? give an example? or is this a known construction and want the name of it? 2012-04-24T13:38:35 i have a measure on the borel sigma-algebra of R and need to show it's sigma-finite 2012-04-24T13:38:50 the measure just gives you the number of rational numbers in a subset 2012-04-24T13:39:19 and sigma-finite is basically just that there's a sequence whose union is the entire space but each set in the sequence has finite measure 2012-04-24T13:39:38 i don't see how it's going to work though :| 2012-04-24T13:39:52 you can put the rationals in a sequence cause they're countable but their union isn't the real numbers 2012-04-24T13:40:16 no, but the sequence of such sets will approach the reals 2012-04-24T13:40:16 and there's a countable numbers of rationals between any two rationals 2012-04-24T13:40:27 sure, but i need the union to be the reals 2012-04-24T13:40:33 not the limit points 2012-04-24T13:40:37 i get it 2012-04-24T13:40:50 still, the it will hold 2012-04-24T13:40:53 -the 2012-04-24T13:41:26 union of a set and its subset will be the same set 2012-04-24T13:41:27 i might just ask my friend tomorrow how he did it 2012-04-24T13:41:35 what? 2012-04-24T13:41:57 B \subset A, then A U B = A 2012-04-24T13:42:16 yes, but that's not what i have 2012-04-24T13:43:36 antimatroid: do you have a printed version? 2012-04-24T13:43:47 of the problem, in electronic format 2012-04-24T13:44:24 Defne u on (IR; B(IR)) by letting u(A) be the number of rational numbers in A (of course 2012-04-24T13:44:24 u(A) = +∞ if there are infinitely many rational numbers in A:) Show that u is a sigma-finite 2012-04-24T13:44:24 measure under which each open interval of IR has infinite measure. 2012-04-24T13:44:59 in A).* 2012-04-24T13:45:19 IR = set of real numbers 2012-04-24T13:45:27 i like how it copy pasted it like that 2012-04-24T13:47:56 |R ? i see 2012-04-24T14:08:56 it's anzac day today too 2012-04-24T14:10:16 anzac? 2012-04-24T14:10:22 Ansatz? 2012-04-24T14:12:01 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2012-04-24T14:14:05 *** smiley1983 has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T14:15:41 antimatroid: so you actually have to prove, that there is a decomposition of the real line, to sets Ai, st. u(Ai) u(open subset of R)=inf is trivial, isnt it? 2012-04-24T14:16:54 du sprichst deutsch? 2012-04-24T14:17:13 ich kann nich spreche deutsch, danke schon 2012-04-24T14:17:30 haha, schon means "already" 2012-04-24T14:17:40 ouch 2012-04-24T14:17:43 mcstar: yeah, by example 2012-04-24T14:18:23 mleise: schön? 2012-04-24T14:18:29 right ;) 2012-04-24T14:18:30 i guess still wrong 2012-04-24T14:18:31 ah 2012-04-24T14:19:54 for most problems in math you just need to find the right Ansatz 2012-04-24T14:20:54 zustandsumme 2012-04-24T14:21:01 thats my favorite 2012-04-24T14:21:28 or 2012-04-24T14:21:31 zitterbewegung 2012-04-24T14:21:37 roflmao 2012-04-24T14:21:46 (i gave a seminor on it, it was quite intersintg) 2012-04-24T14:21:51 seminar* 2012-04-24T14:21:52 Donaudampfschifffahrtsgesellschaft 2012-04-24T14:22:11 a seminar on Zitterbewegungen? 2012-04-24T14:22:15 yes 2012-04-24T14:22:19 wtf? 2012-04-24T14:22:20 -gen 2012-04-24T14:23:25 oh its physics 2012-04-24T14:25:19 i found it 2012-04-24T14:25:33 it is actually quite funny 2012-04-24T14:25:41 but it is quite large, 10mb 2012-04-24T14:25:46 takes a while to upload 2012-04-24T14:26:12 Actually I was at first thinking of Zitterspinne: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pholcidae 2012-04-24T14:26:51 they hide their contours from predators by vibrating like an cell phone 2012-04-24T14:27:08 so thats why they do that 2012-04-24T14:27:17 doest helped much though 2012-04-24T14:27:21 they died anyway 2012-04-24T14:27:31 didnt, help* 2012-04-24T14:27:42 *** choas has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T14:27:48 mleise: you see, just thinking about deutsch, makes my english horrible 2012-04-24T14:27:51 yeah, they don't learn that humans can't be fooled so easily. 2012-04-24T14:28:29 i hope you hungarian didn't suffer 2012-04-24T14:29:57 my hungarian suffers from my english 2012-04-24T14:30:01 not a little 2012-04-24T14:32:08 mleise: http://min.us/mCactRssC 2012-04-24T14:32:16 i uploaded it as a gues, pfff 2012-04-24T14:32:22 guest* 2012-04-24T14:33:32 now what would we do without Wikipedia translations :) 2012-04-24T14:33:53 it was google 2012-04-24T14:34:14 and most of the translations are gibberish 2012-04-24T14:34:20 that was the opening joke 2012-04-24T14:34:31 (the hungarian one is especially funny) 2012-04-24T14:35:07 basically means: proposal shivering 2012-04-24T14:35:38 hehe, yeah I can't understand anything but it looks professional 2012-04-24T14:36:03 zitterbewegung is no proposal shivering?! oO 2012-04-24T14:36:10 XD 2012-04-24T14:39:00 how does bewegung and up as proposal anyway? movement, motion etc. ok 2012-04-24T14:39:05 *end 2012-04-24T14:39:24 well, inditvany means proposal 2012-04-24T14:39:33 but indit = to start something 2012-04-24T14:39:41 so it has to do with motion... 2012-04-24T14:39:57 ah ok 2012-04-24T14:40:41 the chineese one is interesting, when you translate word by word it results in what you got for hungarian, but together it translates correctly 2012-04-24T14:41:17 haha, i didnt go as far as back-translating each of them 2012-04-24T14:49:40 *** delt0r_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2012-04-24T14:51:44 *** dvladim has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2012-04-24T14:55:32 antimatroid: interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fat_Cantor_set 2012-04-24T14:55:47 your mums fat 2012-04-24T14:55:53 :p 2012-04-24T14:56:13 that is cool though 2012-04-24T14:56:24 i've finished the assignment bar what i was asking about before 2012-04-24T14:56:25 yeah, contains no intervals, but has non zero measure 2012-04-24T14:56:26 sleep time 2012-04-24T14:56:37 antimatroid: wait, whats the solution? 2012-04-24T14:56:40 briefly pls 2012-04-24T14:56:43 i haven't solved that 2012-04-24T14:56:49 i said bar that i've finished the assignemnt 2012-04-24T14:57:10 aham, bar means ohne 2012-04-24T14:57:14 k 2012-04-24T14:57:26 i parsed it as 'assignment bar' 2012-04-24T14:57:37 thought to myself, 'set of assignment or something' 2012-04-24T14:57:43 good nite 2012-04-24T15:01:46 amstan: are you using qgraphicsview/scene? 2012-04-24T15:02:03 i tried that at the beginning 2012-04-24T15:03:12 *** delt0r_ has joined #aichallenge 2012-04-24T15:03:26 *** smiley1983 has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) 2012-04-24T15:22:23 *** dici has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T15:24:27 *** g0llum has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2012-04-24T15:25:13 mcstar: no 2012-04-24T15:25:28 mcstar: just a widget where i paint stuff myself 2012-04-24T15:25:56 amstan: then i dont get the scrollbar stuff 2012-04-24T15:26:33 mcstar: https://gist.github.com/2482916 2012-04-24T15:26:35 i had a scrollbar problem with qgraphicsscene, since it contained items that werent necessarily visible 2012-04-24T15:26:36 i finished it 2012-04-24T15:26:56 i didn't want to use an automated scrollbar because some stuff has to stay put for my graph 2012-04-24T15:29:19 amstan: so you handle the scrolling yourself 2012-04-24T15:29:23 yes 2012-04-24T15:29:42 *** Accoun has quit IRC () 2012-04-24T15:29:48 i do it with holding the right mouse button down, and drag the area 2012-04-24T15:29:55 no 2012-04-24T15:29:58 left button 2012-04-24T15:30:02 right is for zooming 2012-04-24T15:30:28 i believe it is more natural than a scrollbar, that was my reasoning 2012-04-24T15:30:57 btw, a qgraphicsscene would do this automatically 2012-04-24T15:31:09 (i was a bit too quick to drop it) 2012-04-24T15:31:12 yes, but it'll also move my axis 2012-04-24T15:32:06