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2013-04-10T13:48:53 *** xScooper has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T14:05:33 mcstar: \o 2013-04-10T14:05:34 yes 2013-04-10T14:05:42 o/ 2013-04-10T14:05:47 kind of great 2013-04-10T14:05:52 tyls 2013-04-10T14:06:07 im not sure if id actually use it, but its a good demo 2013-04-10T14:06:26 mcstar: well, imo ipython's approach is better 2013-04-10T14:06:37 which is? 2013-04-10T14:06:40 throw out the idea of using the terminal as an ad-hoc GUI toolkit 2013-04-10T14:06:48 mcstar: well 2013-04-10T14:06:54 ipython doesn't *really* do it 2013-04-10T14:07:06 i know what ipython does 2013-04-10T14:07:12 just keep text output and interpret ANSI escapes 2013-04-10T14:07:14 but i dont see the connection with terminology 2013-04-10T14:07:19 and then have structured text output 2013-04-10T14:07:24 just a json protocol 2013-04-10T14:07:42 have the shell integrated with the terminal and just implement all the features there. 2013-04-10T14:07:52 the whole point of terminals is easily composing things and having a uniform interface 2013-04-10T14:07:59 no point of applications like vim and weechat in a terminal ;p 2013-04-10T14:08:16 i dont follow 2013-04-10T14:08:29 what do you mean theres no point in vim and weechat in the terminal? 2013-04-10T14:08:45 mcstar: they don't actually take advantage of the positive things about terminals 2013-04-10T14:08:51 they would just be better off as standalone GUIs. 2013-04-10T14:08:52 sure they do 2013-04-10T14:08:57 how? 2013-04-10T14:09:11 terminals are lightweight and they are character based and they are accessible from everywhere 2013-04-10T14:09:49 how is it any better than sshfs + tunnels? ;p 2013-04-10T14:09:51 im not sure if this is the same thestinger im used to 2013-04-10T14:09:56 actually using them over ssh is not fun 2013-04-10T14:09:59 from the latency 2013-04-10T14:10:03 you want them running locally anyway. 2013-04-10T14:10:11 thats your adsl router, remember? 2013-04-10T14:10:13 mcstar: I use weechat because it's a nice client 2013-04-10T14:10:30 well, not adsl and not router 2013-04-10T14:10:31 I would prefer weechat if it had the same featureset in qt, so it could actually have text alignment without mangling urls, etc. 2013-04-10T14:10:37 but you get my point :) 2013-04-10T14:10:51 oh 2013-04-10T14:10:56 thestinger: thats news to me 2013-04-10T14:11:06 i much prefer a console irc client to a gui one 2013-04-10T14:11:21 and i think urls can be opened with a script 2013-04-10T14:11:25 you know I use gvim 2013-04-10T14:11:28 at least, irrsi has such scripts 2013-04-10T14:11:34 thestinger: i didnt know 2013-04-10T14:11:58 i use emacs+gtk2 locally and use emacs+curses over ssh 2013-04-10T14:12:07 * mcstar cant stand gtk3 2013-04-10T14:12:47 enlightenment 17 got a whole new skin 2013-04-10T14:12:53 it looks real nice now 2013-04-10T14:12:57 and kind of stable too 2013-04-10T14:13:08 mcstar: I like keyboard driven interfaces and composable command-lines with nice completion, etc. 2013-04-10T14:13:11 I don't like terminals ;p 2013-04-10T14:13:17 i just cant get used to things like floating window managers 2013-04-10T14:13:18 it just happens that there's overlap 2013-04-10T14:13:33 i like them... 2013-04-10T14:13:33 *** xScooper has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2013-04-10T14:13:49 *** Scooper has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T14:13:50 i didnt know w3m can display images in xterm and framebuffer 2013-04-10T14:13:55 it doesn't 2013-04-10T14:13:57 it overlays them 2013-04-10T14:14:07 they are their own window. 2013-04-10T14:14:08 yeah, thats the same 2013-04-10T14:14:19 well it's just making imagemagick windows on top ;p 2013-04-10T14:14:20 it doesnt work in konsole 2013-04-10T14:14:41 mcstar: https://github.com/unconed/TermKit I love the idea of stuff like this, it was just poorly executed 2013-04-10T14:14:52 they shouldn't have used stupid web tech 2013-04-10T14:14:59 well maybe they should have but... 2013-04-10T14:15:08 how did they manage to make it non-portable? :P 2013-04-10T14:15:17 ive seen a couple js terminals 2013-04-10T14:15:29 it's not really a terminal 2013-04-10T14:15:34 doesn't support vt100 escapes, etc. 2013-04-10T14:15:39 just text and structured output 2013-04-10T14:15:44 there is one that supposedly does 2013-04-10T14:15:48 except he shadowed a bunch of commands 2013-04-10T14:15:49 i couldnt make it work 2013-04-10T14:16:01 mcstar: http://bellard.org/jslinux/ close enough 2013-04-10T14:16:02 ;p 2013-04-10T14:16:25 not that 2013-04-10T14:16:48 well it's a terminal implementation too 2013-04-10T14:17:00 is it available standalone? 2013-04-10T14:17:03 yes afaik 2013-04-10T14:17:19 i thought he was drawing onto a canvas or something 2013-04-10T14:17:29 also http://www.masswerk.at/termlib/ 2013-04-10T14:17:38 mcstar: he implemented a terminal in js tho 2013-04-10T14:18:52 anyway..... 2013-04-10T14:18:57 back to terminology 2013-04-10T14:19:37 it is just a demo, not very usable, but that integrated kind of media can be useful 2013-04-10T14:19:46 i wonder if it could replace a gui file manager 2013-04-10T14:20:11 mcstar: terminals are a GUI. if you're using stuff like ncurses 2013-04-10T14:20:16 maybe it could be integrated with ranger, so ranger could have previews :) 2013-04-10T14:20:17 it's just a really poor GUI toolkit 2013-04-10T14:20:25 it's not cli 2013-04-10T14:20:32 no, thats a TUI 2013-04-10T14:20:48 it's a GUI, the fact that it's in a terminal is an implementation detail 2013-04-10T14:20:49 most of the time it is character based 2013-04-10T14:20:52 so it is not a gui 2013-04-10T14:20:53 vim and gvim don't act any differently 2013-04-10T14:20:58 mcstar: it's not really 'character based' 2013-04-10T14:21:04 they use escape codes, it's an IPC protocol 2013-04-10T14:21:15 now, thats an implementation detail 2013-04-10T14:21:21 it is not a gui 2013-04-10T14:21:30 they get input events via IPC (escape codes) and send draw events with IPC (escape codes) 2013-04-10T14:21:35 mcstar: how is it not a GUI? 2013-04-10T14:21:50 is ipython's qtconsole a GUI? 2013-04-10T14:21:51 because it is a text user interface4 2013-04-10T14:21:56 mcstar: it's not text 2013-04-10T14:21:57 no 2013-04-10T14:22:06 vim doesn't send text to the terminal 2013-04-10T14:22:18 so? it is still text based 2013-04-10T14:22:19 it talks to it via a binary protocol 2013-04-10T14:22:21 mcstar: nope 2013-04-10T14:22:23 binary 2013-04-10T14:22:25 not valid text 2013-04-10T14:22:37 im not talking about implementation details 2013-04-10T14:22:40 i couldnt care less about that 2013-04-10T14:22:50 so it displays to the user as text 2013-04-10T14:22:55 which stops being true the moment you add imageds 2013-04-10T14:22:57 as far as im concerned there could be dogs barking escapes codes or whatever 2013-04-10T14:22:57 it's a GUI 2013-04-10T14:23:19 it talks to the terminal via binary and no longer displays to the user as only text 2013-04-10T14:23:20 i just opened gvim 2013-04-10T14:23:23 i dont see images 2013-04-10T14:23:26 i see characters 2013-04-10T14:23:53 not talking about gvim ;\ 2013-04-10T14:24:08 yes you were saying gvim is a gui\ 2013-04-10T14:24:09 what makes vim a TUI and gvim a GUI? what difference is there other than implementation details? 2013-04-10T14:24:20 mcstar: no I was saying terminals are GUIs when you use ncurses in them 2013-04-10T14:24:28 i say they arent 2013-04-10T14:24:32 at least if you consider gvim a GUI 2013-04-10T14:24:37 i dont 2013-04-10T14:24:52 neither qtconsole 2013-04-10T14:25:01 even though it has images, svgs, etc.? 2013-04-10T14:25:07 even though 2013-04-10T14:25:23 you cant do much with those images 2013-04-10T14:25:40 also, qtconsole has a right-click menu 2013-04-10T14:25:42 you can't do much with images in an image viewer program ;p 2013-04-10T14:25:46 now that tricky... 2013-04-10T14:26:00 i mean, you cant even resize them... 2013-04-10T14:26:03 terminals often have right click menus 2013-04-10T14:26:07 at least i couldnt when i tried it 2013-04-10T14:26:08 and they could allow programs like vim to alter them 2013-04-10T14:26:21 anyway vim in a console still has mouse support 2013-04-10T14:26:27 so it could make a right-click menu itself 2013-04-10T14:26:33 but it doesnt have one 2013-04-10T14:26:48 (not that it should, it is good as it is) 2013-04-10T14:26:55 mcstar: ctrl-n/p 2013-04-10T14:26:57 opens a dialog 2013-04-10T14:27:01 mouse can be used to select one 2013-04-10T14:27:03 ;p 2013-04-10T14:27:10 i think you can disable that inconsistency 2013-04-10T14:27:45 i see 2013-04-10T14:27:48 text meny 2013-04-10T14:27:49 menu 2013-04-10T14:28:11 i thought you meant real gui dialogs 2013-04-10T14:28:17 cause gvim has those too 2013-04-10T14:29:09 thestinger: have you tried this termkit? 2013-04-10T14:29:14 is it stable? 2013-04-10T14:29:20 mcstar: not really ;p 2013-04-10T14:29:25 it was a great idea, poorly executed 2013-04-10T14:29:34 you said that 2013-04-10T14:29:36 he shadows a lot of commands and provides his own 2013-04-10T14:29:39 like cat 2013-04-10T14:29:49 and they don't do what they're supposed to do 2013-04-10T14:30:02 lol i say a youtube video, guy teachies his mum to use archlinux 2013-04-10T14:30:12 guy says, arch linux is a text based operating system 2013-04-10T14:30:14 i go wtf 2013-04-10T14:30:25 wat 2013-04-10T14:30:34 mcstar: oh I have to maintain a dozen haskell packages now 2013-04-10T14:30:36 pity me :( 2013-04-10T14:30:49 what does that mean? 2013-04-10T14:30:51 rustdoc needs pandoc 2013-04-10T14:31:02 oh, it is no imperative mode, right? 2013-04-10T14:31:08 i dont have to 'pity you' 2013-04-10T14:31:09 mcstar: https://www.archlinux.org/packages/?maintainer=thestinger 2013-04-10T14:31:15 it is an adjective, 'pity me' 2013-04-10T14:31:21 ;p 2013-04-10T14:31:22 no->not 2013-04-10T14:31:48 some already need to be rebuilt 2013-04-10T14:31:49 tell them to use cabal or/and haskell platform 2013-04-10T14:32:01 no one wants to spend 5 hours building that crap themselves 2013-04-10T14:32:03 i dont see the point in distro maintained haskell packages 2013-04-10T14:32:12 not having to build crap. 2013-04-10T14:32:14 they dont really want to use haskell then 2013-04-10T14:32:27 well it's a dep for rustdoc. 2013-04-10T14:32:29 ;p 2013-04-10T14:32:37 it uses pandoc as the markdown backend right now 2013-04-10T14:32:37 ouch 2013-04-10T14:32:47 i have to read arch docs 2013-04-10T14:32:57 i wont though.. 2013-04-10T14:33:05 not until it is absolutely necessary 2013-04-10T14:33:33 thestinger: i had to manually fix my friend's /lib->/usr/lib transition on the weekend 2013-04-10T14:33:38 lol 2013-04-10T14:33:43 how was their install so out of date? 2013-04-10T14:33:45 wtf. 2013-04-10T14:33:47 yes 2013-04-10T14:33:51 it just was 2013-04-10T14:33:59 well the /bin transition is soon 2013-04-10T14:34:04 wtf 2013-04-10T14:34:11 mcstar: I guess you had to switch them to systemd too 2013-04-10T14:34:16 yes 2013-04-10T14:34:31 but my system is more out-of-date systemd wise as his 2013-04-10T14:34:37 cause i still have initscripts 2013-04-10T14:34:40 lol 2013-04-10T14:34:50 than* 2013-04-10T14:35:04 there are still a lot of stupid rc.d scripts not removed... 2013-04-10T14:35:17 I should go remove them from all the packages in [community] 2013-04-10T14:35:22 but I'm lazy 2013-04-10T14:35:33 im contemplatin switching to xp 2013-04-10T14:35:41 support ends soon 2013-04-10T14:35:43 :D 2013-04-10T14:35:45 i know 2013-04-10T14:35:58 i discussed it here, some time ago 2013-04-10T14:36:01 no one replied 2013-04-10T14:36:37 i really want to install XP, i want to install a game and play with it finally 2013-04-10T14:36:38 * thestinger is waiting for a rustc bug to be fixed 2013-04-10T14:36:46 hopefully it lands today ;p 2013-04-10T14:37:02 then you can go on with writing your OS in rust 2013-04-10T14:37:26 then I can go finish an itertools clone for rust 2013-04-10T14:37:37 and then trick someone into wasting 10 hours writing a yield -> state machine compiler 2013-04-10T14:37:38 you mean iteratees? 2013-04-10T14:37:48 yes 2013-04-10T14:38:04 but python-style ones (which I guess are like Boost.Range too) 2013-04-10T14:38:10 that know where to stop. 2013-04-10T14:38:25 not that I have a choice, the compiler wouldn't let you write an unsafe one without unsafe {} 2013-04-10T14:38:31 im into graphics algs now 2013-04-10T14:38:39 3d? 2013-04-10T14:38:42 yes 2013-04-10T14:38:53 i implemented marching tetrahedrons 2013-04-10T14:39:03 to extract isosurfaces from a 3d array 2013-04-10T14:39:07 i need it for work 2013-04-10T14:39:15 and probably want to use surface nets next 2013-04-10T14:39:32 and put it in a trivial opengl viewver 2013-04-10T14:39:37 viewer 2013-04-10T14:39:46 i really suck with opengl, forgot a lot 2013-04-10T14:40:07 and then there is some new kind of opengl, graphics pipelines or whatnot 2013-04-10T14:40:23 that replaced the old stack operations based? 2013-04-10T14:41:29 i will write such an isosurface extractor for the gpu 2013-04-10T14:41:55 that way we dont have to move the whole data on the pci bus just to save it 2013-04-10T14:42:18 "(03:05:02) relaxed1: can you change your name because its hard double tapping to get to antonfire's name" lol 2013-04-10T14:42:30 antimatroid: wrong channel 2013-04-10T14:42:34 try it on #math 2013-04-10T14:42:44 no i pasted to the right channel 2013-04-10T14:42:50 i mean the other day 2013-04-10T14:43:00 XD 2013-04-10T14:43:09 oh yeah, that's what i meant to write it to 2013-04-10T14:43:13 nobody replied anyway :( 2013-04-10T14:43:16 *** Wren80[work] has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T14:45:30 antimatroid: if all goes well i can publish into a journal of an impact factor of 28 2013-04-10T14:45:41 nice 2013-04-10T14:45:52 it would be :) 2013-04-10T14:45:59 i have been reasonably productive lately research wise 2013-04-10T14:46:16 also been skating lots, there's a new bowl at bruny island down here 2013-04-10T14:46:32 you showed the construction work 2013-04-10T14:46:38 is that it? 2013-04-10T14:46:39 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OXUttQc231I that's the builders skating it 2013-04-10T14:46:45 still waiting on the clip of the rest of us skating it 2013-04-10T14:47:52 note it's 9 foot in the deep end, the vid doesn't give it justice 2013-04-10T14:47:55 i think its the same 2013-04-10T14:48:16 i bet 2013-04-10T14:48:46 i would be brave enough to jump into it 2013-04-10T14:48:55 if it were filled with water 2013-04-10T14:49:00 was? 2013-04-10T14:49:11 yes, was 2013-04-10T14:49:48 such a nice environment 2013-04-10T14:49:55 must be great living there 2013-04-10T14:51:26 it's a fair trek down to bruny 2013-04-10T14:51:41 you have to drive then get a ferry across to the island, then drive all the way to the other side of the island 2013-04-10T14:52:08 http://goo.gl/maps/RxuOE 2013-04-10T14:52:22 it's pretty much at the top of that oval, you can zoom out to see where you are 2013-04-10T14:52:44 the whole of tasmania is nice 2013-04-10T14:53:37 yeah tassie is objectively the best place on earth :P 2013-04-10T14:53:40 antimatroid: are those forests natural? 2013-04-10T14:53:50 yeah i think so 2013-04-10T14:53:59 most of them anyway 2013-04-10T14:54:09 some trees are grown here strictly for cutting down 2013-04-10T14:54:33 just driving up the east coast is amazing 2013-04-10T15:07:37 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T15:07:37 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2013-04-10T15:09:32 these futurists take it seriously 2013-04-10T15:09:48 i just got the promo, first issue of a new magazine, 128 pages 2013-04-10T15:25:27 *** Wren80[work] has quit IRC (Quit: Wren80[work]) 2013-04-10T15:26:21 *** Wren80[work] has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T15:26:40 *** Wren80[work] has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2013-04-10T15:30:49 *** dici has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T15:50:03 *** foRei has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T15:57:52 thestinger: emacs is f'ed on arch 2013-04-10T15:58:06 lol ;p 2013-04-10T15:58:24 imagemagick provides /usr/lib/libMagickWand-6.Q16.so.1.0.0 and /usr/lib/libMagickCore-6.Q16.so.1.0.0 2013-04-10T15:58:46 but emacs is looking for libMagickWand-Q16.so.7 and libMagickCore-Q16.so.7 2013-04-10T15:59:02 i compiled it with the latest imagemagick installed 2013-04-10T15:59:12 and now i cant run it 2013-04-10T15:59:29 (copying the libs to the expected paths make it work, but thats ugly) 2013-04-10T16:00:26 i pulled the PKGBUILD from abs 2013-04-10T16:05:01 heh 2013-04-10T16:10:08 *** amstan has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2013-04-10T16:14:27 *** thestinger has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0) 2013-04-10T16:15:52 oh, i can format C code like haskell records, nice! 2013-04-10T16:20:38 *** epicmonkey has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T16:34:40 *** epicmonkey has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2013-04-10T17:00:14 *** mcstar has quit IRC (Quit: mcstar) 2013-04-10T17:08:55 *** RagingDave has quit IRC (Quit: Ex-Chat) 2013-04-10T17:16:33 *** dici has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2013-04-10T17:16:42 *** thestinger has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T17:56:38 *** coeus_ has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T18:42:06 *** thestinger has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0) 2013-04-10T18:44:52 *** amstan has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T18:44:52 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o amstan 2013-04-10T18:57:00 *** Scooper has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2013-04-10T19:19:03 *** djr_ has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T19:20:06 *** thestinger has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T19:44:19 *** mceier has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2013-04-10T20:04:06 *** mceier has joined #aichallenge 2013-04-10T21:15:16 *** Garf has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)